why do I need a MAOI to trip with shrooms and mimosa?

[chalkface]

hello all swims out there...

I have a really basic question...hoping someone can shed some light. Recently I have been doing cambodian cubes and found them a bit lacking in the visual/spiritual department...a friend of mine whose name is also swim recommended I mix them with some mimosa and also some shredded cappi vine...i trust this guy and so plan to do as he says....but Im not sure why I need to have a MAOI in the mix, which in this case is apparently the cappi....very curious. I have already been online about this matter but just get lots of corporate style websites saying that MAOI is an anti depressant....just seems wierd to me....why do i need an anti depressant?

Can anyone write me a few lines explaining why a MAOI is neccesary? Please forgive me if this sounds like a stupid question. Im just getting into all this stuff so I dont know a great deal.

Okay thanks.


man this white font on black is a bit of headfuck

 

[benzyme]

you don't really need an MAOI, just eat more mushrooms. visuals will come with increased levels of psilocin.
you friend merely suggests throwing mimosa and caapi in the mix, because dmt isn't orally active without an maoi. that's not the case with psilocin

maoi's are more than antidepressants, they prevent the rapid metabolism of several types of ligands containing amino groups.

 

[Ginkgo]

Hey, and welcome to the Nexus!

MAOIs (Monoamine oxidase inhibitors) works by inhibiting the enzyme MAO from working. When you ingest tryptamines, these substances are metabolized by MAO-A. With oral DMT, you will not be able to get any effects without a MAOI, as MAO-A metabolize the substance so quick it wont reach the brain.

As MAO also metabolize neurotransmitters such as serotonin, it can be used as an anti-depressant. Ingestion of MAOIs prevents serotonin, psilocin, DMT, etc. from being broken down. When it comes to entheogens it is used to prolong and intensify the effects. You should not have to take a MAOI to get effects from mushrooms, as psilocin is active by itself.

How many grams of mushrooms have you eaten? It could be that you need higher doses, every body and mind is different, thus dosages are different from person to person. A possibility is that you have excess MAO enzymes in your system. If so, you could try to take MAOIs (Syrian Rue, Caapi) two to three times a day every day for two to three weaks. This should force the body to make new MAO enzymes, hopefully this time in a more moderate concentration.

I hope this helps...

 

[polytrip]

As said, mushrooms don't need MAOI's to be orally active on their own, like DMT. Caapi will potentiate the effect of shrooms though. It will also alter the experience because caapi is an entheogen by itself. It will make the experience more ayahuasca-like. Some people don't like the combination of shrooms (possibly because of the strength of potentiation) while others do.

If you intend to use MAOI's then caapi is definately the best source.

But just start with a moderate dose to see whether you like this combination or not.

 

[benzyme]

maois will alter the experience by adding catecholamines into the equation
that is, elevated leves of dopamine and norepinephrine, which psilocin doesn't typically affect.

 

[chalkface]

allright....i certainly appreciate all your responses..........I wrote some things in reply to what you guys were saying........below

you friend merely suggests throwing mimosa and caapi in the mix, because dmt isn't orally active without an MAOI. that's not the case with psilocin

well basically I just asked him how to make the mushies (cubes) a bit more of a spiritual journey, and he suggested mimosa but pointed out that for it to work I would have to do a MAOI as well, and cappi was the best one. Cubes are okay but they only take you so far...but thats all I have to work with right now...they are easy to grow and I am a novice at this kind of thing. I dont think eating more cubes is gonna work...at least not for a more spiritual connective kind of experience.

You should not have to take a MAOI to get effects from mushrooms, as psilocin is active by itself.

well like i was saying....the mushies work okay its just they are cubes and so the effects are...well, like cubes. They space you out okay and everything is funny and a bit wierd but thats about it...I dont really have any way to get the other more intense varieties of mushies so im kind of stuck with cubes and was just looking for a way to potentiate them a bit.

How many grams of mushrooms have you eaten? It could be that you need higher doses, every body and mind is different, thus dosages are different from person to person.

usually do between 3 and 5 grams dry....was mexicans last few months and now I have some cambodians....most things i have read online say there isnt much difference between one cube and another. I dont really know to be honest. 5 grams dry doesnt seem all that strong really...at least not compared with some of the full-on trips I had when I was younger

start with a moderate dose to see whether you like this combination or not.


sound advice...i have had a bad trip a few years back and it was a hellish experience....it put me off psychadelics for a long time but now I am gradually getting back into them...like I was saying to my mate, i cant think of anything better to do than try connect with higher realms and I am crap at meditation and all the various other methods at attaining higher states without ingesting mind altering stuff...so here i am trying to re-embark the path mother nature intended for us.

anyway...having said all that I am faced with a new bummer..... .

I now have a basic grasp of what MAOI is and certain effects and whatnot....and now I am kind of stumped cos the thing is this......since i had an absolute nightmare of a bad trip about 10 years ago, nowadays I always do a 5mg valium and have a largish shot of whiskey before tripping...it just calms me down and takes the edge off any anxiety I might have prior to coming up...works fine with mushies...but this MAOI business is way more complicated....says anti depressants are not to be mixed with MAOI, and neither are stimiulants, one of which is alcohol.....

So by mixing cappi, cubes and mimosa I will be having a greatly increased trip intensity, but wont be able to do my valium whiskey thing beforehand.....this makes the nerves jangle just thinking about it really. Bad trips are no joke.

Would it be a better idea to go for passion flower as the MAOI, cos the MAOI effect is milder than cappi, and then that way I might still be able to my 5mg of valium and whiskey thing....which are my tried and tested bad trip precaution measures .....what do you guys think?

sorry to ask all this.....any advice would be well appreciated

 

[Ginkgo]

You take valium before you travel? No wonder you don't get much effects, benzodiazepines drastically reduce the effects from psychedelics.

 

[The Wizard]

You take valium before you travel? No wonder you don't get much effects, benzodiazepines drastically reduce the effects from psychedelics.

yea...whats the point of getting all numb before and experience..no wonder its not spiritual for you

 

[chalkface]

ah....then obviously thats where im going wrong. LOL...my girlfriend was absolutely wasted last weekend on 5 grams and I couldnt see what all the fuss was about.

thanks man....gonna have to rethink my strategy.

 

[chalkface]

You take valium before you travel? No wonder you don't get much effects, benzodiazepines drastically reduce the effects from psychedelics.

yea...whats the point of getting all numb before and experience..no wonder its not spiritual for you

well...bit nervous I suppose, what with being out of the scene for so long. I had no idea it would decrease the strength of the trip.

 

[Ginkgo]

ah....then obviously thats where im going wrong. LOL...my girlfriend was absolutely wasted last weekend on 5 grams and I couldnt see what all the fuss was about.

thanks man....gonna have to rethink my strategy.

5 grams is indeed a wonderful dose, on 4-5 grams and upwards is where the real fun starts. Try 3 grams without valium to test the water, then really jump in the next time.

There's nothing to be really afraid about. Everyone feel the fear from time to time, the key is to not give into it. You ARE peace, concentrate on that thought and breathe all the negative energies out... Breathe deep and slow with your stomach.

 

[g13juggalo]

MAOIs usually give you a slight effect, which helps make antidepressants. I personally am against most pharmaceutical anti-depressants. But in this case, you're using caapi. Which isn't an antidepressant. MAOIs also make so your body basicly doesn't filter things.
MAOIs make shrooms a lot stronger, usually twice as strong or so.
and the DMT in the mimosa will only give you an effect if you have an maoi.

 

[Ginkgo]

But in this case, you're using caapi. Which isn't an antidepressant.

Not true, the harmala-alkaloids in Caapi can be used as anti-depressants. Great anti-depressants, actually.

 

[jamie]

MAOIs usually give you a slight effect, which helps make antidepressants. I personally am against most pharmaceutical anti-depressants. But in this case, you're using caapi. Which isn't an antidepressant. MAOIs also make so your body basicly doesn't filter things.
MAOIs make shrooms a lot stronger, usually twice as strong or so.
and the DMT in the mimosa will only give you an effect if you have an maoi.

Cappi does MUCH MUCH more than stop your body from filtering things..harmalas for one thing are prob better anti depressants than anything thedoctor will give you..

Caapi also contains THH, which is an SSRI..and actaully helps the brain to build more seratonin receptors..the whole concept behind the use of pharma antidepressants is the idea that the brain is not getting enough seratonin..with more seratonin receptor sites the seratonin in the brain will be better utilized..

This seems to be a much more healthy and non invasive method of fixing depression due to low seratonin than the methods of pharma anti-depressants that are more invasive and sort of force more seratonin on the brain.

 

[chalkface]

gonna try the recomended 3 gram dose of cubes without the valium this weekend....Im still having the shot of whiskey though.

thanks for all the input people....a tip of the hat to ya's all

 

[norcereus]

I am shocked to hear that you have been using valium with your shrooms, vile I can understand the idea, I belived it to be childs knowledge that valium will kill the psychedelic trip. I have used a valium as an amulet vile embarking on heroic doses togh, but I never did need to take it. It made me fell safe to have the option, so no bad trip. The lesson to lern is to be shure of the sett and setting, you need to feel safe, if something is not rigt wait a day or until next opurtunety, it is realy important. as Terence Mcenna sead do 5 grams in silent darknes and you will know what the muchroom can do.
And as other's have stated maoi's and shrooms can be the toughest trip of your life, even Terence did it only once, it lasted to long and was to strong. So be espesialy careful with maoi and shrooms, if you must potentiate the shrooms use a veak maoi as yohimbe or curcumin or do a smaler dose of shrooms (3g Peganum harmalla 1g shrooms)

remember sett and setting is most important
good luck in you jurnies

 

[Ginkgo]

Alcohol will also numb the trip, although not as extensively as benzodiazepines do. Try mushrooms without sedatives! It is nothing to be afraid of! I really can't see how you can think it is a good idea to mix something that gives incredible knowledge and spiritual growth with drugs that cause an attitude close to that of a monkey. Monkey-enlightenment?

 

[g13juggalo]

You guys took me too litteraly. xD
I'm sure any maoi's especially caapi make great anti-depressants. I meant its use here isn't as an anti-depressant.

 

[jamie]

persoanlly I would say screw the valium and alcohol and face the medicine with a clear head..otherwise whats the point?..your just afraid becasue you had one difficult experience in the past?..maybe this path isnt for you..these things are not all fun and games, yes difficult things come up when you work with the medicines, it is all a part of it..seems taking valium every time now due to fear of something that happened once in the past will never help you move past it..

Clouded with sedatives and alcohol, you arent going to experience the mushrooms for what they are as themselves..did you even concider that its those things that are not allowing the visuals?

I dont get it really..you say that you are afriad to go deep into it becuase you freaked out once..so you take valuam and alcohol to dull the experience..then state you arent getting decent effects from the mushrooms..and then ask about adding MAOI's and mimosa on top of all that?

No offence to you just making all this clear..best of luck with your journey..I hope without the valiums you get what you need.