"Bufo" [Incilius alvarius care tips requested]

[Stoner420]

I am new to this group, but I have been for a few years working closely with shamans or so-called healers, I personally deal with a lot of issues, including my disability and going through ceremonial sessions with the medicine has sparked my interest in owning two Colorado River toads I’ve only milked one of them two years ago about.

I now have his venom a.k.a. 5 MEO DMT, I’m looking for anybody who has done this before and how I should properly store and if I was to use this in a ceremony how I know the proper dosaging, etc.

I have kept it in a secure jar that is meant to keep things from UVB lighting and other temperatures from infecting the medicine.

Also, both of my toads are in great condition and health and I have only like I said milked the male toad one time and only did two of his glands in the front. At least I know that when I do it to them, they’re not gonna be stuck in the wild defense list. They have 120 gallon terrarium and it’s bioactive.

If anybody has any information that can help me properly guide me through doing this the right way obviously there’s going to be people doing it regardless of education, but I want to be as much educated before I end up taking my own medicine from my own toads.

 

[Transform]

Colorado River toad - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Thread title will be disambiguated, as there's potential for confusion with the substance bufotenine.

It’s not really an equal comparison because the amounts relative to each other have very different quantities, but I do understand your point, personally I’m of the opinion that these very small quantities don’t really have any noticeable effect on the experience other than that they perpetuate self suggestion of perceived effects. I personally have only smoked synthetic 5-MeO-DMT and crystalline bufotenin, there effects are worlds apart.

Anyway one more thing I would like to add is that there is no evidence of traditional use of 5-MeO-Dmt in its current format of smoking toad venom, so going the natural way is not really anything more than giving in to the marketing of authenticity. Therefore please consider using the synthetic version as this will help to conserve the life of the toad, the recent increase in demand is now already pushing these toads to more and more remote places and if we keep on going to milk them we will soon have none left at all.

Now I wil stop derailing your thread with my remarks.

All the best to you and your journey.

That's essentially to say, there are serious issues with anything that popularises toad usage.

 

[Transform]

Both the wikipedia article and @Varallo's comment summarise the situation quite effectively. Interest in toad venom threatens to wipe out wild populations. If these pet toads aren't part of a breeding program to bolster numbers for reintroduction to the wild, it's not really helping.

Obviously, securing access to synthetic 5-MeO-DMT can be difficult, so we also need to consider focussing on viable plant sources of the molecule, which is the subject of ongoing discussion here over the years. Certain strains of Phalaris grass show promise, for example.

The Phalaris Analysis Thread

Phalaris growth and harvest conditions and alkaloid content To increase Phalaris alkaloid content, fertilize with ammonium sulfate (Parmar, 1974), and grow in partial shadow, 28% sunlight ( Festi & Samorini 1994). Cut and discard the first grow, and instead harvest the top half of the regrowth...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

~Phalaris = The Way Of The Future~

Hello Fellow Nexians & tryptamine enthusiasts: Phalaris is a genus of grasses. Various species of Phalaris grow on every continent except Antarctica. They can be found in a broad range of habitats from below sea level to thousands of feet above sea level and from wet marshy areas to dry places...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

Research - The nexian phalaris breeding programme

Preamble Grasses, enduring through the ages, have flourished upon the earth, unravelling the fabric of reality to reveal the underlying essence of the cosmos. With each seed sown and every plant nurtured, nature's mysteries unfold before us, guiding us toward a promising tomorrow. Within this...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

 

[Stoner420]

I appreciate you guys with your honest opinions. I totally agree with the animals being used and thrown back into the wild being defenseless after people milk them without the so-called proper care of doing it. As I already own male & female toads I don’t know if I would ever breed them, but I know I will not get rid of them until they pass away one day so until then I don’t have the room to grow any plants which would be the next thing I wanted to get into was growing the plants to extract.

As of right now, I just wanna make sure with the toad venom that as long as I am doing it the way I was taught through obviously the Internet and other groups and not using too much or too little for ceremonial use.


But I totally agree with you guys people do have these animals and probably abuse them and not given the proper care. I’m not four of those, grabbing the toad in the wild and milking it and then throwing it back out being completely defenseless at least with mine they get taken care of and everything. I just don’t think I abuse them when I did milk. I was gentle with him. I also had a second pair of hands all I really did honestly have my friend lightly touch his glands, and I would stick my face in front of the glass and make it seem like I was gonna eat him which gave him the natural instinct of shooting it out himself instead of us squeezing really hard like other people do.

But at the end of the day, yes you’re not wrong with the so-called abuse of it, but I don’t treat it as it’s abusive. I also did a little bit of extra studying on. Can it kill them if you do it and apparently doing it too much could stress him to death so that’s why I’ve only done one time out of two years And if I proceed to do more, it would just be a couple times every few months.

MODERATOR EDIT: NO TALK ABOUT BUYING/SELLING IS ALLOWED!

 

[northape]

No discussion on selling, buying, sourcing, acquiring, pricing, trading, receiving, distributing, mentioning pending deliveries or smuggling of drugs

Attitude Page - DMT-Nexus Wiki

wiki.dmt-nexus.me

I know you are deep into it at this point, but try to make it right. Selling this is the wrong approach, in my opinion.
These secretions are a stress response, and I doubt that is good, clean medicine energetically.
Maybe just enjoy their company, free them, or something. That is much better karma for you.

Much love

 

[northape]

What are the toads' names? They look beautiful.

 

[Stoner420]

No discussion on selling, buying, sourcing, acquiring, pricing, trading, receiving, distributing, mentioning pending deliveries or smuggling of drugs

Attitude Page - DMT-Nexus Wiki

wiki.dmt-nexus.me

I know you are deep into it at this point, but try to make it right. Selling this is the wrong approach, in my opinion.
These secretions are a stress response, and I doubt that is good, clean medicine energetically.
Maybe just enjoy their company, free them, or something. That is much better karma for you.

Much love

What plants would you recommend if I wanted to go a different route? Honestly, the only reason I wanna salad is because it is expensive to maintain and also I just put $1000 into a better terrarium for them, but I’m not looking to be a so-called dealer just somebody that can contribute to ceremonial use by myself with many disabilities the 5MEO has helped me tremendously The hence why I got the idea of owning them as my pets, but trust me the last thing I wanna do is squeeze her little venom glance to get myself high & others I’ve owned my male for over three years now and I just recently a year and a half ago got a female. In fact, my idea is if I can no longer keep them due to poor conditions or the fact that I can no longer afford it if that’s the case, I would let them loose, but I would have to let them loose somewhere in the desert, which would be impossible for where I’m located, but I intend to keep them as long as they can live naturally.

But yes, I completely understand everyone against the whole milking and also using them for the so-called medicine but like I’ve said, I’ve only tried the toad venom three times in three different ceremonies. I don’t look at it as someone going on the side of the street trying to buy some 5MEO it’s to me more of a spiritual thing than it is get rich quick in fact, I don’t even care to get money for it. It’s just to help pay for the big amount of money I spent on the terrarium.

But if you have any advice on what type of plants are available that are easy to grow and maintain

 

[Stoner420]

What are the toads' names? They look beautiful.

( Male ) Cheech & ( Female ) Jade

 

[northape]

( Male ) Cheech & ( Female ) Jade

I would breed them occasionally, just to sustain the population and for my own conscience.
If you plan to keep them with you, treat them as family. You do not sell your children to spiritual cult leaders for sex. How is this different?
Use the venom for yourself and very sparingly. Just communion with these creatures is medicine. You'll get much more out of it this way.
Bless you

 

[Stoner420]

I would breed them occasionally, just to sustain the population and for my own conscience.
If you plan to keep them with you, treat them as family. You do not sell your children to spiritual cult leaders for sex. How is this different?
Use the venom for yourself and very sparingly. Just communion with these creatures is medicine. You'll get much more out of it this way.
Bless you

Oh no, I would never sell the toads. They are definitely my family. I actually have a 24 seven camera on them. I even do streams once in a while because they’re such a goofs lol

But as like I said, I would definitely use it just for my own self medicinal wise, but since the medicine is a powerful substance, I usually don’t like doing it alone, so I tend to go to these people that are part of a network of shamans not like your typical shamans that are weird just a group of people that travel the world doing medicine not knowing how they get it all the time because that’s their business but I know that most of them tend to get it from people in Mexico that just grab them do the milking and throw them back in the wild But apparently some people have people that do what I do and they breed them, but I don’t know if they treat them with a care since they probably milk them every single day, which I would never do only when I need it. But like I said, I’ve only done it once after two years so I’m not somebody who abuses it obviously in fact, I only do ceremonies once a year.

But yes, you’re right. I should just keep it for myself and not give a shit about them even though I would like to contribute to helping people with issues in the world, but I can’t actually be somebody to be there and support them so instead I would give it to a healer or shaman if you wanna call them to make sure they’re getting the proper medicine not from some boot legged person that’s what I guess I was talking about.

But it is funny how you do call them cult leaders because they do kinda have that weird feeling to them. They are a bunch of strange people, but aren’t we all

 

[northape]

But yes, you’re right. I should just keep it for myself and not give a shit about them even though I would like to contribute to helping people with issues in the world, but I can’t actually be somebody to be there and support them so instead I would give it to a healer or shaman if you wanna call them to make sure they’re getting the proper medicine not from some boot legged person that’s what I guess I was talking about.

Yeah, at this point people need to help themselves. You are responsible for yourself and your family circle; there is no need to go and play saint. We have some real saints out there for this.

Just be real, man. You do not need to earn extra credit from anyone but yourself. Try to research an independent use (like training a few friends on how to deal with medicine). Use low doses and very occasionally. Maybe find a small circle of people who do it if you want reassurance. Strange people are fun until they start to use you. I am not saying that is the case, but it is better to have some independence. You will see right away if they are cultish or not when you have other people to turn to.

All the best. Keep your head cold and clear when it comes to so-called shamans. They are people like you and me.

 

[Stoner420]

Yeah, at this point people need to help themselves. You are responsible for yourself and your family circle; there is no need to go and play saint. We have some real saints out there for this.

Just be real, man. You do not need to earn extra credit from anyone but yourself. Try to research an independent use (like training a few friends on how to deal with medicine). Use low doses and very occasionally. Maybe find a small circle of people who do it if you want reassurance. Strange people are fun until they start to use you. I am not saying that is the case, but it is better to have some independence. You will see right away if they are cultish or not when you have other people to turn to.

All the best. Keep your head cold and clear when it comes to so-called shamans. They are people like you and me.

You’re 100% correct definitely gonna take your advice on that that was kind of like my original idea was to keep it between me and a few small group of close friends/ family and you’re right they are people just like you and me.

 

[northape]

I just put $1000 into a better terrarium for them

Just let it be. Consider it an investment in your future health. Most likely you will get it back, but maybe in some other form.

But if you have any advice on what type of plants are available that are easy to grow and maintain

Oh, just look through the forum for a few days. You will see what people use just by looking at different categories and topics.
If you want to grow something yourself:

The Ethnobotanical Garden

Preserving plant wisdom

forum.dmt-nexus.me

However, if you are so keen on working with toads, just go with it and see how you can pay them back. It will come to you naturally.

 

[Transform]

Yeah, sorry we don't really have any toad care experts here and not only because of the ethics stance, but I do agree it would be best if you were able to give them the best life possible for the time being.

Seeing as you already have a toe if not a toad in the door of the herpetarium scene you will probably get care tips more within that sphere than one focused on psychoactive plants - although you are of course still welcome here especially that you're now aware of our rules. It would also be wonderful if your relationship with your pets were a gateway for you to become more involved in toad conservation, perhaps. I think it's also worth noting from the wikipedia article, however, that there have been prosecutions for keeping these toads with the intent to use them for their psychoactive properties so it may well be to your advantage to be able to talk about them from a conservation viewpoint anyhow.

 

[GTRm8]

When you gonna milk it?

 

[Transform]

When you gonna milk it?

I'd suggest you read Stoner420's posts again, and carefully. That should provide the full context.

 

[GTRm8]

I'd suggest you read Stoner420's posts again, and carefully. That should provide the full context.

Well, he's milked it 2 years ago, and I've asked about the next milking. Have I missed anything?

 

[Stoner420]

Well, he's milked it 2 years ago, and I've asked about the next milking. Have I missed anything?

I just can’t discuss it anymore. I don’t wanna break any rules, but as I can say, I have no idea.

But if you wanna ask, I guess from the first time it was definitely an interesting experience, but I can’t answer that question though on when the next time will be.

 

[Transform]

Well, he's milked it 2 years ago, and I've asked about the next milking. Have I missed anything?

Can you honestly say you put sufficient effort into making your ↓first question↓ clear enough? Really??

When you gonna milk it?

 

[northape]

When you gonna milk it?

Maybe it is a fine question, but it is very far from the spirit of this thread. Sometimes you need to read between the lines, too.
Something like, "What is your next step?" would be more fitting. Just saying...

I just can’t discuss it anymore. I don’t wanna break any rules, but as I can say, I have no idea.
But if you wanna ask, I guess from the first time it was definitely an interesting experience, but I can’t answer that question though on when the next time will be.

Good response, Brother. Decide on your path and go with it. Do not let others sway you. Welcome