Decriminalization And Commodification: Considerations From The Underground

[SnozzleBerry]

This is the talk I gave at Psymposia 2015. Hope it presents some good food for thought/discussion

[YOUTUBE]

 

[DeDao]

Snozz is the perfect, well-spoken, mature representative for the Nexus as a whole and we all should appreciate his impactful presence here.

Thanks so much, Snozz, for being such an awesome human being.

From the bottom of my heart,

Dao​

 

[The Traveler]

Good talk snozz!

And for those that like to watch more presentations from DMT-Nexus members:

The Nexian - Presentations


Kind regards,

The Traveler

 

[Swarupa]

Great talk, as i said i really like the foresight you put into it, i often think about the details of how the therapy clinics could be... i don't really see the future of psychedelics as something that will happen in the future, it's always happening now

Thanks for the link Trav, i was just looking for something to follow up Snozzs talk

 

[Curb]

on the point of having to get involved, going and doing something rather than thinking just being aware is enough... its very true. so much of our lives are taken up by computers and other technology nowdays that everything is at your fingertips, you dont have to do much more than think about what you want and boom! there it is, so i think thats why people get in their own little 'im a conscious person' bubble

though, having physical/dietary needs met is not enough for any of us, we need to feel like we achieve things and that we are going somewhere, in some grand direction. cultural narratives, virtual stories and promises of science and technology thats going to fix the world for us. but here is what i think:

We already have the greatest, fastest, most beautiful, long lasting technology that man will ever be capable of creating. OURSELVES. Biology isnt often thought of as a technology but it certainly is, its been through beta, had a massive implementation phase and here we are in full function. how great would it be to have the freedom of engaging more directly with tools which enhance and further develop the technology of biology

Loved your talk Snozz, thanks for representing the nexus

Edit: imagine how different 'drug use' would look in a culture that accepts, knows how to use properly and engages with people who know a thing or two about the benefits and pitfalls. i guess thats what conferences like this are evolving into, if drug laws follow the momentum of public attitude.

 

[RAM]

Brilliant! You're doing amazing, world-changing work Snozz. I see the video is unlisted and only available to people who have the link; maybe you could change that so it could reach a broader audience?

I absolutely love, as one of the audience members mentioned, how you put psychedelics in a social and political context which really legitimizes them in my opinion. It's not very good to be an old conservative who claims "oh all drugs are of the devil" nor to be a teenager who says "everyone in the world needs to drop acid, man" (though I'll admit I've had that thought more than a couple times ).

What we must actually do is open an intellectual, utilitarian dialogue, like the one you did, where we can discuss the future of psychedelic plants and compounds using logic and reason instead of emotion and extremism. Commodification will definitely become an issue for psychs as it has with marijuana, in my opinion. However I think there are many fundamental differences between marijuana and something like tobacco for example; no matter how much of a commodity weed is made out to be, one can still rather easily have some sort of cathartic experience on it.

I live near a town with a giant marijuana festival every year where people gather and get high. It's fun and I'm sure many people have a great time and even some little realizations, but I think it would be difficult to do this with LSD. I often think about how psychedelics would even be sold if they were legal/deregulated. Also would there be an across the board ending of prohibition, i.e., are we going to allow methamphetamines and heroin to be legally produced and sold too?

There are arguments now, like you cited in the beginning of the video, about how cartels cause so much violence and how legalizing certain drugs could stop that. But do we really want corporations and their marketing departments pushing substances and experiences on us? And if there are massive taxes, won't there still just be black markets anyway?

As crazy as it may sound, I think the system for procuring drugs isn't actually that bad right now. Although the illegality is horrible and so many people are prosecuted for little to no moral reason, there are still millions of people who do find their substances if they look hard enough (just look through every trip report on Erowid and the Nexus - I'd make a big wager that the great, great majority of these occurred illegally with no institutional repercussions). People can't just go to the store and pick up eggs, milk, bread, and an ounce of cubes, but clearly there are still ways to procure drugs if you look hard enough, do enough research, and really want it.

With the current and impending marijuana reform laws, I think that the times ahead will be very turbulent and rapidly changing, especially with our generation of rational-minded, techy hipster types. It's a good thing that we have people like you to conveniently sum everything up for us and bravely present it in a neat package.

 

[Doc Buxin]

What a great presentation...

Very well thought out & executed with some rather pertinent, poignant points all the way through.

Good job Snozz!!!:thumb_up:

 

[Praxis.]

Fantastic talk Snozz, very thought provoking! I get worried when I think about the implications of post-prohibition, so I'm really excited about many of the things you touched on. Particularly, I'm really excited about the model that STS offers; when we think of harm reduction I think it's really important how we frame it--we cant just stop at set/setting or proper identification/dosage; we need to consider a vast range of implications including sourcing.

And great points touching on the PIC, and also how the state will just find new ways to fill the prisons if drugs are no longer criminalized. So many other things in our culture are criminalized, it's really important to recognize the ways that these institutions work to bring people in--we can't lose sight of the larger picture. Being able to smoke weed or eat acid freely might come at the expense of immigrant communities, as you said, in addition to countless other groups of people who are criminalized because of their circumstances or identity.

I also can't help but think about things like drug tourism or cultural appropriation in this context. How many more people will be willing to pay big bucks for an Ayahuasca or Peyote session, and how will that demand be met without compromising local biodiversity or community integrity? And I can't even imagine the number of hippies who would open their doors to start selling ceremonies.

I guess it just goes to show how nuanced these things are; everything is connected, there is no such thing as a single-issue. Awesome job presenting and laying this out for people, I think you really gave many of us a few things to think about. I wonder what we'll do with it...

Great job and thanks for all your work! :thumb_up:

As crazy as it may sound, I think the system for procuring drugs isn't actually that bad right now. Although the illegality is horrible and so many people are prosecuted for little to no moral reason, there are still millions of people who do find their substances if they look hard enough (just look through every trip report on Erowid and the Nexus - I'd make a big wager that the great, great majority of these occurred illegally with no institutional repercussions). People can't just go to the store and pick up eggs, milk, bread, and an ounce of cubes, but clearly there are still ways to procure drugs if you look hard enough, do enough research, and really want it.

Look at the impact that illicit MDMA production is having in Cambodia, or look at the number of people currently locked up in prison for petty weed possession. Drugs are easy to find for anyone who wants them, availability is not the issue though.

 

[TGO]

Well done!

:thumb_up: :thumb_up:

 

[SnozzleBerry]

Thanks for the positive feedback. I feel like the issues covered here are really just the tip of the iceberg. Given the limited time there wasn't space to cover the expansion of privatized probation services and the implications of corporations having control over incarceration outside of prison (in the forms of surveillance, technology, and documenting parolee adherence).

As Praxis points out, I think the ecological impacts of drug tourism and consumption are arenas that are often overlooked, and if we look at other spheres, such as food production, I'm not sure that there are really any laudable models. A lot of "green" and "organic" products still carry significant environmental costs. The big question, to my mind, is can we grow enough of our own?

Can we actually create a decommodified system of mutual aid where people in certain climates can trade plants (live or otherwise) with people in climates that lend themselves to drastically different plants/fungi? I'm sure some members here can testify how difficult it is to grow tropical plants in their region...and even in the tropics/sub-tropics, it does take a good bit of time to grow some of these plants. What would it look like to work with folks in Hawaii or other tropical areas where some of these plants grow completely out of control...could we actually establish some sort of collaborative harvesting/trade endeavor that keeps things peer to peer? Would people actually be interested in taking such an approach, or would commodifying such endeavors be easier/more likely?

I see the video is unlisted and only available to people who have the link; maybe you could change that so it could reach a broader audience?

I currently have the video as unlisted because Psymposia operated the conference at a loss and is renting their conference videos in an attempt to recoup some of the operating expenses. As I wanted to share it with all of you, but not detract from their fundraising efforts I opted to make it unlisted for the moment. Down the road, I'll likely make it public, but for the time being, please feel free to share it with people you feel would be interested, and if you like it/have interest in the other Psymposia vids, consider renting them through the Psymposia site.

Sorry for the blatant pitch...these guys just ran the conference on a shoestring budget, worked hard to do it right, and put in a lot of time/energy. I'd like for them to at least break even on the endeavor.