Entactogenic tryptamines

[AlbertChemist]

Hi All,

This is a topic that has fascinated me for quite some time: Entactogenic tryptamines.

The best best known examples are probably alpha-ethyltryptamine, and alpha-methltryptamine.

Most entactogens studied so far have been phenethylamine derivatives, and entactogenic tryptamines remain a largely unexplored area - but one with a lot of potential.

I'm really curious to learn as much about this topic as possible and wanted to ask about what entactogenic (or partially entactogenic, like 5-MeO-MiPT) tryptamines (or indoles in general) you are aware of. I'm especially interested to hear for what indications you think they could be used medicinally.

I'm creating this thread for people to share anything they know about entactogenic tryptamines (which ones exists, what their subjective effects are and any other interesting lore on this fascinating topic).

Let's pool our knowledge and experience on this understudied topic. Any contribution helps increase our collective understanding.

Cheers! :d

 

[bismillah]

I personally found that dmt had a distinctively entactogenic aspect to it for me. In fact, it bled over into my sober mind and never left. Or do you mean something more tangible (being in a room with a person)?

I always trip alone and feel this love at a distance.

 

[AlbertChemist]

I meant more something whose acute effects are entactogenic. So something that facilitates interpersonal communication, for instance.

 

[OneIsEros]

I’ve been experimenting with eating harmine+5-MeO-DMT. It’s not quite an entactogen in an emotional sense, but the sense of touch.... wow. Even washing my hands feels great, comparable to MDMA for me in that sense. Also almost no visuals until an orgasm, at which point I see colours. So entactogen? No, but touch and sex drug? Yes. I love sex on psychedelics in general, but this one is special.

I only take between 5 and 10 mg of 5-MeO-DMT by the way, and I feel some chest/breathing issues at that dose. Nothing threatening, but it’s there. I don’t really recommend it. It’s pretty dangerous.

 

[benzyme]

5-MeO-DiPT is notoriously entactogenic.

 

[rOm]

I’ve been experimenting with eating harmine+5-MeO-DMT. It’s not quite an entactogen in an emotional sense, but the sense of touch.... wow. Even washing my hands feels great, comparable to MDMA for me in that sense. Also almost no visuals until an orgasm, at which point I see colours. So entactogen? No, but touch and sex drug? Yes. I love sex on psychedelics in general, but this one is special.

I only take between 5 and 10 mg of 5-MeO-DMT by the way, and I feel some chest/breathing issues at that dose. Nothing threatening, but it’s there. I don’t really recommend it. It’s pretty dangerous.

Funny you're called "OneIsEros" and mention this, but only time I had sex on pharmahuasca was harmalas and 5 MeO DMT oral...
So felt dangerous, thought I'd die, and never happened as such with oral DMT before ( well maybe with vaped in bad setting) but once I was stabilised I was good and my GF had the desire to have sex ( prolly 5 MeO makes you very good looking on the mojo ), and it was a great idea. It add something to the experience, I mean also pharmacologically,probably the endorphins were a nice addition.
SO yes I can also say oral 5 Meo ( dangerous combo with harmalas but do 5 to 10 mg at most and know that its safer boofed/ plugged /rectal and works with no MAOI/RIMA if plugged).
It was great but given the risks,I never tried it pharma again... although I thought I'd try it again at 10 mg...

 

[AlbertChemist]

I’ve been experimenting with eating harmine+5-MeO-DMT. It’s not quite an entactogen in an emotional sense, but the sense of touch.... wow. Even washing my hands feels great, comparable to MDMA for me in that sense. Also almost no visuals until an orgasm, at which point I see colours. So entactogen? No, but touch and sex drug? Yes. I love sex on psychedelics in general, but this one is special.

I only take between 5 and 10 mg of 5-MeO-DMT by the way, and I feel some chest/breathing issues at that dose. Nothing threatening, but it’s there. I don’t really recommend it. It’s pretty dangerous.

That is really interesting and I wonder what dose you took. I've been somewhat weary of combining an MAOI with 5-MeO-DMT since there have been several fatal overdoses with it - likely from a kind of serotonin syndrome. But if one remains below a dangerous dose (whatever that is), it may well be that it is precisely those serotoneric effects that give the combination some entactogenic character.

 

[AlbertChemist]

5-MeO-DiPT is notoriously entactogenic.

Thanks for the tip. I definitely agree, though for me it also has a very pronounced psychedelic character.

 

[downwardsfromzero]

I hope people are aware of the difference between "entactogenic" and tactile enhancement. Otherwise there would have been no point in coining the word entactogen. "En-tacto-gen" - "within-touching-producer": a substance that facilitates communication of inner psychological material. Hence, the use of MDMA in PTSD psychotherapy. The similarity to the word tactile is perhaps unfortunate, as the tactile effects of such compounds are somewhat coincidental if not incidental.

Etymology does not necessarily correspond to pharmacology

I'm definitely in favour of tactile enhancement, but if that's what you're looking for please use the right terminology.

 

[AlbertChemist]

Thank you so much for this comment, I implicitly assumed that people know what I meant by the word entactogen. Like you, by `entactogen' I mean a substance that can facilitate clear, open communications between two people (couples, patients, therapists, etc...) while taking the ego out of the communication. Of course, most entactogens also have a somewhat psychedelic or tactile-enhancing character. But what I'm really interested in is tryptamine that can help facilitate open communication.

(Frankly, on most psychedelics, especially at higher doses I can barely even talk let alone communicate openly.

I'm curious to hear what people have experienced in that direction.

 

[cubeananda]

5-MeO-MiPT in very very low doses;1-2 mg perhaps. The effects start to change into some visual, more puddly effects after like 7mg+ IME but at the lowest dose you can weigh it is kind of a entactogenic tryptamine.

 

[dragonrider]

Potentially, every psychedelic substance can be an empathogen. But ofcourse there are substances that are way more prone to generate such effects than others.

But the question is whether you are merely looking for a "social lubricant", or rather a way to realy connect with a persons soul.

MDMA is known to facilitate all kinds of social feelings. I think mostly by temporarily melting away the social inhibitions that we all tend to have. But how much of it is lasting?

Ayahuasca, mescaline or LSD work differently. They much more tend to amplify what's already there, so if there is a distance between you and another person, they'll amplify that distance, and if there are positive feelings, then those feelings will be amplified.

I think the closeness facilitated by these psychedelics tends to be much more durable, because it is more real. It is much more than just "getting high" together. You much more get to know the person you're with.

 

[AlbertChemist]

I definitely mean entactogens along the lines of MDMA, that facilitate open, non-judgmental communication between two (or more) people.

While LSD, mescaline, ayahuasca, etc.. can certainly do this to some extent. I often find that clear verbal communication is actually somewhat inhibited by them. The insights gained from these substances are far more abstract and cosmic, in my experience.

MDMA-like entactogens on the other hand, seem to be ideally suited for facilitating this kind of interpersonal communication and healing. The realizations you may get are more down-to-earth, but this can be extremely useful for such things as resolving conflict and honestly talking about ones feelings. One is almost compelled to do so on a true entactogen, while a psychedelics are almost too powerful to bother with such trifles as using up all the time that the effects last for solving a couples problems, etc... It can happen of course, but with an MDMA-type entactogen it almost has to happen.

This is why I am asking if there are tryptamines whose effects `demand' (in a judgmental way) that one use the state of grace obtained by them to resolve interpersonal issues through direct verbal communication.

 

[doubledog]

In my experience, aMT is not very entactogenic substance, really not comparable to MDMA in this aspect.