How to be social?

[Infectedstyle]

Here a topic i really need help with. I am 21 years old and i'm starting to get real sick of the way i feel. It is basically a case of social anxiety and fear of intimacy. It keeps me from meeting up with people and having any more than just shallow conversation with other people.

As a start, pressure builds in my chest as i'm trying to recall what i need help with. It doesn't bother me so much now because i feel like i'm working on my problem by making this thread. I have high hopes that i can really find instructional advise on this forum. It doesn't have to be much, but usually whenever people try to help there's always something useful in people's input that happens to stays with me.

Not sure where to begin, i first noticed there's something "off" with me when after hanging out with a bunch of guys for 2 years some of them pointed out that i'm really quiet. And i guess boring to be around. It's not noticable when i'm with a comfortable group of 1-5 people. But when i am alone with someone there's just a great lack of substance or interaction. Whenever i'm alone with another person i just want to leave. When it's someone i love that i'm running for i can really spiral into a depressed state that lasts for weeks.

I have a female neighbour right now, whose 19 and we are pretty good friends, sort of. I'd love to hang out with her more but it's impossible. I notice a particular change of feeling that is at the core of what is happening.

I can have a lot of courage build up inside of me to face another person. Then as soon as i see that other person my mind turns blank. My self-confidence just fades away. Then i automatically try to fake a conversation, make shallow observations and crack nervous jokes to try and comfort the situation. I miss substance when i'm with other people. Then i can get really hyper-aware of other people's discomfort around me. I really want to learn how to be comfortable with another person. It gets really lonely.

Busrides or trainrides where you are forced to sit next to another person is hell for me. I always can't wait to get out. "Talking to bring comfort" does not work because all conversations i have with people die within the second they are born. (not entirely true but most of them do)

I also notice there's an awkward energy present when saying goodbye to people. It just doesn't feel right for me, and loads of times leaves me with a sour taste to the whole interaction. I dunno wtf is up with that. I guess this saying goodbye thing has to do with my fear of being lonely and not really wanting to say goodbye.

The real cracker here is that i can't even be comfortable with myself. I do everything to try and make it through the day. Since i avoid doing things with other people and there's not much in this world that i can do on my own i tend to do some weird shit that keeps me busy for a few hours a day. Not good for the soul. And amounts to even more social anxiety/fear and shame.

Ye.. Not much more i can say about this. I tried to give you some information to work with, but it's hard to define my issues. Just that it absorbs 80% of my mind's energy and i can't figure it out by myself.

 

[cyb]

You're not alone...(bin there, dun that)
Aside from being young still and the possibility that this will dissipate with age and social experience...I would definitely look into 'High-Functioning Autism or Asperger syndrome'.
HFA and AS are on the same spectrum and can vary considerably in degrees. (I'm HFA)

Tests can be performed by a professional or by yourself (try this one Take the Autism Test )

It can be illuminating to find out and sometimes an answer can make things so much easier.

{also: Spiritual Awakening negates all worries...but it may take a lifetime to get there...or just a few days...you'll know when it hits you.}

 

[Ryusaki]

I have a female neighbour right now, whose 19 and we are pretty good friends, sort of. I'd love to hang out with her more but it's impossible.

Why?
Really...ask yourself that question. Unless its some external factor you can't control, there is no reason to believe that you cannot hang out with her.

I can have a lot of courage build up inside of me to face another person. Then as soon as i see that other person my mind turns blank. My self-confidence just fades away. Then i automatically try to fake a conversation, make shallow observations and crack nervous jokes to try and comfort the situation. I miss substance when i'm with other people. Then i can get really hyper-aware of other people's discomfort around me.

Don't do this, don't fake a conversation, don't focus on discomfort. It doesn't matter. And most people can detect fake body language anyway. You ever thought that their discomfort is a mirror image of your discomfort. Stop faking it and speak from your heart, if people look down on you or are not nice, DISREGARD THEM. They are not your friends, you don't need them.

The biggest obstacle to your existence as a free and sovereign being, is the pressure to conform.

The real cracker here is that i can't even be comfortable with myself. I do everything to try and make it through the day. Since i avoid doing things with other people and there's not much in this world that i can do on my own i tend to do some weird shit that keeps me busy for a few hours a day. Not good for the soul. And amounts to even more social anxiety/fear and shame.

You know this is the root of your problem. You can't be comfortable with yourself, how could you be comfortable with another person?

Its you, who is doing this to you.
What is it that hinders you to be relaxed and content?

 

[Aegle]

Infectedstyle

I can understand how you feel... I am quite a shy person by nature and the techniques I have found invaluable in strengthen my confidence are:

1. Meditation
2. Traveling
3. Attending drumming circles and more community orientated gatherings as apposed to forced social interactions
4. Actively cultivating my inner strength and awareness in-turn which allows me to be more comfortable with being alone. As being able to truly be calm within the moment is key to growing self confidence
5. Growing and nurturing activities like yoga or tai chi which strengthen the mind and the body, which create an equilibrium within oneself
6. I also have found that taking regular journeys back to nature alleviates anxiety profoundly, make sure to receive healthy amounts of sunshine as it is an incredible mood elevator
7. Entheogens like Catha edulis also do wonders in alleviating social anxiety, within moderation of course

I wish you the best of luck, safe and happy journeys my friend.


Much Peace and Happiness

 

[Guyomech]

All great advice so far. It's important to remember that we are all like this to some extent, especially while younger and finding oursrlves. Those strong self-confident people you meet all the time? Faking it, mostly. I say this because it is very unhelpful for you to imagine yourself as a lone sufferer of this problem. It's universal.

As a youngster I was very awkward. Any attempts at "coolness" or whatever always fell flat. But as time passed I found that by being myself, honestly and without embellishment, people apparently found me more likeable. This led to a sort of positive feedback loop where the more "me" I was, the better I got along with the world. So I know this is easier said than done, but: relax. Be yourself, don't second-guess how you should be behaving. I bet there are a lot of likeable things about you that you just need to share, honestly and without fear. You'll be fine.

 

[Infectedstyle]

Thanks for the replies, I'm already feeling a bit better and find myself having more constructive thoughts after making this thread. Still very afraid. I'm already feeling anxiety thinking about being alone with my thoughts tonight.

Going to write an appropiate response when i get home. Hope we can speak more about being comfortable with that girl, as i think she is like my counter-part in a lot of ways. I think if i can have a balanced relationship with her i can have this with everyone. I have always felt me meeting her is destined to be a learning process for the both of us.

Besides, i think the both of us are a bit lonely and bored. Hanging out frequently would make both of our lives so much more better. The reason we can't hang out is because it just doesn't feel good. Social interactions are a complicated subject and differs person to person. But i've had some thoughts about how us two get along it will take some time to write this down. Hopefully when i get home i can get more into that because i think it's key. It will probably help me to organize my thoughts as well, but i'm going to need some input.

Brings me to point 3. from Aegle. The santo daime has a circle social setting. I have been there twice, i HATED it. I hated being a part in the circle. I think this experience serves as a perfect memory to explain my discomfort in an exceggerated experience like Santo Daime. But maybe such a ritual is just not for me.

Those 7 points @Aegle are definitely key. All these things bring self-confidence, which is what i need. Positive experiences. The only thing i am missing is a guideline to draw upon when interacting with others socially. Just a chronic lack of knowing what to do. Which leads to BAD experiences, which is ofcourse the opposite of what i need. :\

 

[Infectedstyle]

All great advice so far. It's important to remember that we are all like this to some extent, especially while younger and finding oursrlves. Those strong self-confident people you meet all the time? Faking it, mostly. I say this because it is very unhelpful for you to imagine yourself as a lone sufferer of this problem. It's universal.

As a youngster I was very awkward. Any attempts at "coolness" or whatever always fell flat. But as time passed I found that by being myself, honestly and without embellishment, people apparently found me more likeable. This led to a sort of positive feedback loop where the more "me" I was, the better I got along with the world. So I know this is easier said than done, but: relax. Be yourself, don't second-guess how you should be behaving. I bet there are a lot of likeable things about you that you just need to share, honestly and without fear. You'll be fine.

Those words are golden, Guyomech.

There's a lot of likeable things about me. Entheogens helped me see all that. I'm just a drag to be around is all. And i need to fix that in order to shine a more powerful light into the world. And be a lightsource amongst thousands of others of whom a bunch of them frequently visit this forum.

Again, gonna write up this situation with my neighbour to go into the social aspect more. Although, i think it will be a bit too personal and might have to leave this thread as it is. Otherwise there's going to be too many wall of texts from my part and some things i'm just gonna have to figure out by myself.

 

[obliguhl]

I assume you have already checked out my two social anxiety threads - if not, do it now, because there are a ton of gold nuggets to be found.

As for your specific situation, i would ask myself why i feel that i'm boring. Just because you're not an outgoing person? If that was the case, half the population would be dull - but it's actually more than that But all joking aside, i smell a big case of repressed emotions here. You need to create situations in which you can lose total control while being with other people. Just so you know you CAN do it! I don't care if these situations are medicated or not. Tons of people drink every weekend just to "get crazy" - or at least what they believe is crazy. Perhaps travel to another city - you won't see anyone of them again, so who cares if you curse like a sailor on mainstreet while wearing schoolgirl uniform - ok, the police, and tourists...and potential homophobes. But i would assume that you don't live in russia. Anyways, perhaps you just need to find out, that you have it in you.

All easier said than done. I like low dose mescaline cactus extract. Have you tried it? If not, order some succulents today!

edit: Oh, and if you are looking for techniques, check out this site: Page Not Found | www.succeedsocially.com

 

[Infectedstyle]

I have started reading your thread about social anxiety and it IS good. Minxx's post put anxiety in a very reasonable perspective and all the more motivates me to work on it.

I'll try some mescaline later in life, friend wants to grow a cactus. I don't. Right now, i'm looking into growing a Salvia plant, i think it will do the job as well.

By the way, I have had nightmares that are DMT and Anxiety related. One of them involved a genetically evolved spider sitting in my DMT jar. Upon analysis, i think the genetically evolved spider symbolizes a deeply rooted fear i inhereted from a young age that i will have to face if i do dmt again.

The next evening i had a dream of going on the nexus and somebody questioning quite agressively my ability to handle pharmahuasca. Having not done pharmahuasca yet, and being disappointed with the short duration of smoked dmt i think i might accept the challenge to do pharmahuasca.

Btw @cyb, i have an official dose of PDD-NOS autism. Did more than one test on autism. I found that when i lack confidence i have autism. When i am feeling confident and make the test i do not have autism. PDD-NOS is on the verge of both sides, i think. I am happy to have the label though, it helps me in life. But i tend to look at life more spiritually rather than disorders and orders.

 

[Vodsel]

as time passed I found that by being myself, honestly and without embellishment, people apparently found me more likeable. This led to a sort of positive feedback loop where the more "me" I was, the better I got along with the world.

^ for me, it turned out to be this.

And yes it can be difficult to put in practice, but I think this is It. And even if being yourself doesn't make everyone around like you more, it will make people who like you meaningful. Who wants to be friends with someone who likes some alter ego, but not you? Remember the saying, be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind won't matter, and those who matter won't mind. This is true. You don't want people to judge you wrong. As long as I have a choice, I won't hang out with people who expect me to be someone else. I made this mistake once with a girl, with marriage being the cherry mistake on top, and it took me years to get out of it. So I get your point, Groucho, but I don't want to belong to any club that won't accept me as a member.

As you said, understanding and labeling your issue does help a lot.

Essential tremor and the concurrent social anxiety made my school and high school times often frustrating and unpleasant. But once I learned what it was, and started to be straightforward about it, the problem shrunk and became way more manageable. When some friend (or potential friend) glanced at my hand shaking, I would simply explain what it was. Then perhaps crack a little joke about it. "You see, not that I'm that nervous now. I just have this thing called essential tremor. No biggie, but I had to come to terms with the fact I suck at stealing tambourines."

This also turned out to be an invaluable filter against hypocrites and assholes. And some times people may reply with a confession of their own, and that's pure gold. If not the beginning of something, it will be a big check mark for your self acceptance. Social anxiety happens under your own scrutiny. It's your own look at yourself, and for as long as you cannot change that look on your own, you have to use others' eyes.

And to add both one entheogen and one pharmaceutical to the list of suggestions, keep in mind kava and beta-blockers as tools to consider.

 

[jamie]

drop all of the games that you play out inside of your head..drop the bullshit. It never helps in the real world. Trust me. Your going to get burned either way. Might as well just not care about what people think, because some people will think totally irrelevant/arrogant/demeaning etc things anyway.

Social anxiety is ALL about these games you play inside of your head. It really should be all about YOU and less about THEM. You don't have to live they're life at the end of the day, but you still have to live yours. Might as well live it without self conviction.

It's not easy t get to that point, and you don't suddenly just end up there.

 

[Jin]

i have to totally agree with Jamie here ,

the less you care about people , the less anxious you'll be

social anxiety is the result of too much caring what other people think

i also don't understand why people are so important to people , i just treat other people like they are another monkey like me and since we are all monkeys i could care less about what they think or not

 

[Guyomech]

Vodsel, always spot-on.

Here's another thing that I've noticed: The less you care about the rejection of others, the less likely they are to reject you.

 

[Infectedstyle]

I'm always angry at the convictions people have about me. There's something about the way they look at me which makes it hard or impossible for me to function normally.

But then i realize is that i am in charge of changing this. And it is past experiences other people have had with me that helped forging these convictions in people's heads. A thorough change of conviction by setting a different example is needed because we are talking about people i love.

First feeling i felt today was fear. It's motherfucking pissing me off by now.

 

[Phantastica]

Hello there my friend! I agree with the wisdom herein. Indeed we must stop giving a single fuck about what people think. Let me add my perspective to this. Sitting and thinking about social interaction will not make it happen. It requires ACTION. Its the most powerful force in the universe. ACTION.
You need to plan out how you are going to live your life, and once you have decided, BE WILLING TO DIE FOR IT.

I feel you completely brother. I have had my fair share of suffering when it comes to this. So I really want you to listen closely.

Social anxiety is a mere confidence and perception issue. And you can address it through a number of ways.
I am laying out a "prescription" here that has worked for me and taken me to great heights. I am sure that you too will find it greatly helpful; but it requires ACTION. Some here might disagree with my extreme suggestions, but these are just subjective opinions that I live by.

1) Get Anthony Robbins' "Get the Edge" Program. It is available freely on torrents.
1) Stop using marijuana and tobacco (if you are using it) cold turkey, and swear to never touch it again.
2) Stop abusing all psychedelics, and never take them more than once a month. I have stopped using psychedelics altogether, and will not be touching them again for decades to come. In your case, I would suggest you do the same. Psychedelics merely amplify your present perceptions; thus it is critical to first make your life a masterpiece, and then explore other states of consciousness that psychedelics allow.
3) Exercise regularly, (at least 5 days a week) - Gym, Running, Sports, etc... whatever interests you most.
4) Join a Toastmasters Club! They are super cheap and widely prevalent.
5) Practice public nudism at clothing-optional beaches, and meditate.
6) If you are attending a college/university, and are a student like me, then do all of the following:
i. Take up Communication and Speech courses. In fact, throw yourself in the abyss, and declare yourself as a Communications Major or, at the very least, a Minor.
ii. Take up singing and voice classes.
iii. Take up any available dance classes.
iv. Take up beginning level courses on Theater Arts and Acting.
v. Join social clubs that interest you.
vi. Join a sports team if you're into that.

The idea is to redefine your psychology, so that it is always upbeat and in a certain state of mind. Initially, this will not come easily, since we have been practicing certain states of mind (i.e. trances) throughout our lives. To redefine it will require work, but eventually, with practice, it will become default.

7) Stop masturbating and watching porn. See www.yourbrainonporn.com Also look at works by Mantak Chia on this subject.
8 ) Finally, read a good book on making love. My favorite two are David Deida's The Way of the Superior Man and She Comes First by Ian Kerner.

Find your passions my friend, and indulge fully. Find your purpose and indulge fully. What is prescribed above is not a prescription, but a LIFESTYLE. If you want to make deep changes, then, change everything...your entire lifestyle. Since this is a lifestyle, don't expect quick changes...put aside at least 3 years to get good at the list above, after which period, you will continue refining your life and expand into directions that are in sync with your choice of lifestyle.
I know it seems like a long list, but you must do every single thing that you can. Once again, this is a lifestyle, and therefore all that matters. This is how I was able to conquer many of my fears, and the work is still in progress.

I guarantee you...you complete that list above, and you will not be the same person.

P.S. ACTION.

 

[Infectedstyle]

@Phantastica,

Great list and i think it raises some valid points.

Exercise and eating well are great mood-enhancers. I was able to process a lot of agressive energy yesterday by lifting weight. And i keep eating well so i guess i am feeling good and healthy most of the time.

I think being comfortable nude is not essential but should be sought after. Especially if you plan on having sex it is appropiate to be comfortable with yourself. Was a problem for me but i've been doing great. I accept my body.

I have started a training in Krav Maga fighting. The whole things adds to a certain "warrior" lifestyle that seems to fit me. It's hard work though, and i am going to have to convince myself it is worth the effort to change my life into something positive every day when i wake up.

I've decided against taking a communication course for the time being. I keep the option however if the problem persists or gets worse in 2014. Also because it is keeping me from going to class regularly and is affecting my future.

Porn, tobacco, marihuana, alcohol. these are all addictions and i think work much in the same way. Instead of doing those things i could use my energy to work on fighting skills and doing schoolwork. Which i think is so important for my future happiness. Both of these things enhance my masculine identity, which brings a tremendous amount of self-confidence. Hate homework though, but having a diploma and a good job are important for a masculine identity in this current society.

About psychedelics, i'm going to respectfully disagree with quitting and tripping once a month. The idea of taking small doses of mescaline each day kind of appeals to me. It is a lifestyle i guess. Higher doses are a different story, i can see that once a month is good enough to remind myself of the things worth living for.

 

[RoGu3]

I use to get horribly anxious when talking to people I didn't know or were trting to impress. Its ok tho man it does get better. I really have like no anxiety anymore.. about anything. Whether its girls or whatever. You just have to know that people are just like you down to the core and you share very similar aspects of your personalities. Some people hqve the same fear but then what you two can overcome it by noticing that you share a common fear. Lol its weird but that's one way. Really people just want to be loved, and when you're alone. Just realize you really aren't alone. We are all one! Of one mind.

Don't get nervous because you have a gazillion things you want to say to someone right away, just be cool and feel the good vibes because you give off that anxious vibe when you feel that way, it doesn't make people like you less, you have to realize they also want to feel connected. But I understand it can be overwhelming. Drugs have helped my fear of people and made me realize I really love people and am happy to be around them most of the time. Im sober now tho. I just partake in DMT occasionally. I hope some of this helped at least. It just comes thru lots of experience. It doesn't just happen but in a way it does.. if that makes sense. You'll develop a stronger connection to people and and a stronger sense of empathy with people, a realization that we are all one. I also don't smoke weed anymore which used to make me really nervous and anxoius at times. Like being around my boss or certain people in general. Its all in your head tho man just breathe deeply and try to have fun. Try not to take things too seriously. You are a gift from God. Some people just need a little help getting unwrapped lol I'm only 22 btw so were not too far off age wise

Try eating healthier, excercising, drink more water, meditating, and very importantly breathe deeply thru the diaphragm. These are all very good things. I don't know if not masturbating is the way to go but maybe slow down if you do it a lot lol part of me does feel guilty after doin the deed sometimes :/ I don't ever watch porn tho

 

[obliguhl]

There's something about the way they look at me which makes it hard or impossible for me to function normally.

Have you ever videotaped yourself to see how YOU look at others? I know what you mean, but i figured that most of them are just reflecting back what i throw at them...or are just worried, anxious, depressed etc themselves.

It is NORMAL that people feel miserable in day to day life.

 

[SpartanII]

I've had really illuminating experiences by intentionally being social as I'm coming down from a trip or roll, particularly LSD and MDMA. It feels like my brain, mind, and emotions have been reset and I have an empathic, and sometimes, dare I say, telepathic? connection with other people.

No need to have social anxiety if you remember that we are all One...all part of the Multi-verse/Godhead, right?

 

[112233]

There's something about the way they look at me which makes it hard or impossible for me to function normally.

It is NORMAL that people feel miserable in day to day life.

No, it is not normal. No one should accept misery as a "natural" part of day to day life.