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Is safrole psychedelic?
- Thread starter 69ron
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69ron
Esteemed member
It looks like everyone is getting positive experiences from Elemi oil. This is in stark contrast to nutmeg where most people don’t really like it much.
I have yet to read a negative trip report for Elemi oil.
One thing people should take note of is that Elemi oil does vary in potency. Average elemicin content is about 4% I believe, but it varies from 2%-20% or so from what I’ve heard. So you should probably test the waters with each batch you get to see how potent it is before taking a large dose.
It’s no doubt some of us will purchase super potent Elemi oil, while others will get crappy oil. It’s likely that all brands vary. Since it’s pretty much all from the Philippines, it probably doesn’t matter what brand you use. I think they are all pretty much steam distilled in the Philippines and then just locally bottled and labeled with a “BRAND” name. So there’s likely no difference between one brand or the other except the pretty label and price you pay for it. I’m sure you can probably get the best deal if you purchase it in the Philippines.
I have yet to read a negative trip report for Elemi oil.
One thing people should take note of is that Elemi oil does vary in potency. Average elemicin content is about 4% I believe, but it varies from 2%-20% or so from what I’ve heard. So you should probably test the waters with each batch you get to see how potent it is before taking a large dose.
It’s no doubt some of us will purchase super potent Elemi oil, while others will get crappy oil. It’s likely that all brands vary. Since it’s pretty much all from the Philippines, it probably doesn’t matter what brand you use. I think they are all pretty much steam distilled in the Philippines and then just locally bottled and labeled with a “BRAND” name. So there’s likely no difference between one brand or the other except the pretty label and price you pay for it. I’m sure you can probably get the best deal if you purchase it in the Philippines.
69ron
Esteemed member
Dorge said:
You might want to try taking it in honey directly in the mouth. That seemed to be the best method so far that SWIM has tried. It came on fast, in about 15 minutes, peaked after about 1:45 hours, and produced the strongest visual effects do date from 10 drops. It was quite a bit stronger than 10 drops taken in a capsule. I think it's more effective sublingually.
69ron
Esteemed member
SWIM is going to try 10 drops sublingually of direct oil, no honey in a minute (he can’t sleep). He’s NOT going to swallow any of it. He’ll hold it there for about 15 minutes and then wash his mouth out with mouth wash to ensure none is swallowed. That way we can know for sure if it’s active sublingually or not.
...Update, after 30 minutes nothing is noticed yet. The oil wasn't bad tasting actually. It's rather mild. Maybe SWIM is just getting used to it. It made the mouth numb a little (from the small amount of methyl eugenol present most likely) right after taking it. SWIM's mouth is still slightly numb. Other than that there's nothing to report yet.
...Update, after 1:25 hours, SWIM cannot tell if there are any effects. Either SWIM has tolerance to it or it doesn't work well sublingually.
...Update, after 30 minutes nothing is noticed yet. The oil wasn't bad tasting actually. It's rather mild. Maybe SWIM is just getting used to it. It made the mouth numb a little (from the small amount of methyl eugenol present most likely) right after taking it. SWIM's mouth is still slightly numb. Other than that there's nothing to report yet.
...Update, after 1:25 hours, SWIM cannot tell if there are any effects. Either SWIM has tolerance to it or it doesn't work well sublingually.
69ron
Esteemed member
Dorge said:
I think it's probably a good idea if each of us uses a different method of ingestion. More can be learned that way I think.
So what's your take on it so far? Would you say it's more like a low dose of LSD or mescaline or something else?
69ron
Esteemed member
Dorge said:
I bet they do too. SWIM will try that. That's definitely on his plate.
Right now SWIM is very interested in just the Elemi on it's own, for the sake of figuring out all he can about what Elemi oil is exactly. But soon he'll try it with mescaline. He's not yet found his favorite dose of Elemi oil. I think 10 drops is mild and SWIM can push the dosage much further than that.
PsilocybeChild
Rising Star
"...thus encouraging inner peace and tranquility.."
I must say I felt this effect.
"As soon as hints of unpleasant effects kick in, if they do, SWIM will not up the dose any further and consider that the maximum dose."
I will also try to note this point.
" It SEEMS like it will become fully hallucinogenic and remain pleasant based on the tests SWIM has done so far. "
I agree. If not, it is still a quality experience unlike anything that I know of.
" not bad. Almost like a sort of citrus camphor actually."
It tasted like nutmeg to me. yuck
I must say I felt this effect.
"As soon as hints of unpleasant effects kick in, if they do, SWIM will not up the dose any further and consider that the maximum dose."
I will also try to note this point.
" It SEEMS like it will become fully hallucinogenic and remain pleasant based on the tests SWIM has done so far. "
I agree. If not, it is still a quality experience unlike anything that I know of.
" not bad. Almost like a sort of citrus camphor actually."
It tasted like nutmeg to me. yuck
69ron
Esteemed member
PsilocybeChild said:
Maybe yours is high in elemicin. That should give it more of a nutmeg flavor I believe.
SWIM didn't like the flavor much at first, it was too much like eating a flower, but it's definitely growing on him. His oil is not as strong tasting as nutmeg, but there is definitely a slight nutmeg flavor to it. It also has a slight flavor of cloves. But the flower-like flavor is the dominant flavor in his oil.
SWIMS defntely does not taste like nutmeg at all... it smells like some camphor oils swim has bought... which shouldnt smell like elemi lol... my point on that is that they do sell the raw resin of this tree for people to use for lots of purposes, and distilling it and making the essential oil is one of those. I am pretty sure essential oil companies buy the resin right from them and they distill it themselves. The way they distill, and the equipment they use is all going to have an influence on it... amount of heat... all kinds of details.
So some will be better then others, and seeing how no one is making it to have high elemicin yet lol its going to take people ordering from different sources and trying them out.
SWIM would say it is probably like a low dose of LSD or mescaline, it was not too intoxicating... it allowed swim with the assistance of some good herb ( which really brought out the effects and euphoria) to break through the funk he was in. It also allowed him more ready access to more intuative problem solving in regards to relationship issues ect.
SWIM thinks it works fine with alcohol.
Some resiniods and oils... will have a hard effect on the ol kidneys though... it maybe a good idea for us to figure out how to get the elmicin simply out of the oil. I am not refuting that this stuff is benign on the body... but irritation to the kidneys long term can be a slow problem we deal with later... might be a good idea... its still just kitchen chemistry not synthesis... but on that note swim would like ot figure out how they add that ammonia molly to it.... and if that could be done in a simple kitchen chemistry sort of way...
So some will be better then others, and seeing how no one is making it to have high elemicin yet lol its going to take people ordering from different sources and trying them out.
SWIM would say it is probably like a low dose of LSD or mescaline, it was not too intoxicating... it allowed swim with the assistance of some good herb ( which really brought out the effects and euphoria) to break through the funk he was in. It also allowed him more ready access to more intuative problem solving in regards to relationship issues ect.
SWIM thinks it works fine with alcohol.
Some resiniods and oils... will have a hard effect on the ol kidneys though... it maybe a good idea for us to figure out how to get the elmicin simply out of the oil. I am not refuting that this stuff is benign on the body... but irritation to the kidneys long term can be a slow problem we deal with later... might be a good idea... its still just kitchen chemistry not synthesis... but on that note swim would like ot figure out how they add that ammonia molly to it.... and if that could be done in a simple kitchen chemistry sort of way...
you can warm the honey first... SWIM used to make herbally infused honeys... you have to warm the honey to mix things into them.
SWIM made a perfume with everclear... added a little water which made it louche, looks damn cool. It will be great for sanpedro and changa ceremonies as well. This has amaziing medicinal qualities which are really synergistic with the entheogenic healing process gee SWIM wonders why?
If the oil absorbs sublingualy then the addition of the everclear ( watered down alittle) is going to help with rapid absorption. its kinda like a mouth wash... So traditionally you get a small mouthfull and spray/blow it onto people, objects ect... this is what they do with florida water ect... asone does this with the perfume it will be absorbing sublingualy every time you use it... neat. you could also just make a mouth wash out of it, but swim is still not totally sold on whether or not it is active sublingually yet.
SWIM made a perfume with everclear... added a little water which made it louche, looks damn cool. It will be great for sanpedro and changa ceremonies as well. This has amaziing medicinal qualities which are really synergistic with the entheogenic healing process gee SWIM wonders why?
If the oil absorbs sublingualy then the addition of the everclear ( watered down alittle) is going to help with rapid absorption. its kinda like a mouth wash... So traditionally you get a small mouthfull and spray/blow it onto people, objects ect... this is what they do with florida water ect... asone does this with the perfume it will be absorbing sublingualy every time you use it... neat. you could also just make a mouth wash out of it, but swim is still not totally sold on whether or not it is active sublingually yet.
69ron
Esteemed member
Dorge said:
Definitely don’t over do it. The major thing in Elemi oil is d-limonene, and many of the other components don’t appear to be toxic to the liver or kidneys, and are approved for use as flavorings, as is the entire oil, but no long term tests in humans are known for Elemi oil in particular, especially at psychedelic doses.
I would treat it like alcohol and simply not overdo it. The last thing you want is liver damage or something like that. Nutmeg oil is approved as a flavoring but it contains safrole which is shown to cause liver damage in rats (safrole isn’t in Elemi oil), so it should also not be used too often. Elemi oil is simply an unknown.
People do eat essential oils all the time though. Just because something is an essential oil doesn’t automatically mean its bad for you. Basil oil is often added to pizza sauce, Cinnamon oil is often added to pastries, Nutmeg oil is also added to pastries, Elemi oil is found in food as a flavoring, etc.
We eat oils all the time, but in small doses. Oranges contain Orange oil, lemon’s contain Lemon oil, etc. We also breathe this stuff in all the time. Flowers emit essential oils as fragrance. Most perfumes contain essential oils.
Essential oils are all around us. Most should be used in small doses only, some should be avoided altogether, many so called “non-toxic” oils can become toxic in high doses.
You should treat Elemi oil as an RC. Like most RCs, little is known about its effect on your health. With its main component being d-limonene though, it doesn’t look to be that harmful. D-limonene is sold as a supplement in doses up to 1000 mg. A 10 drop dose of Elemi oil is about 240 mg and contains about 120 mg of d-limonene as the major component. You would need 2000 mg of Elemi oil to get a dose of 1000 mg of d-limonene, that’s roughly 83 drops of Elemi oil (about 2.3 ml of oil). 83 drops of Elemi oil would contain about 80 mg of elemicin, quite a whopping dose.
69ron
Esteemed member
Dorge said:
SWIM's sublingually only test above shows its either not effective sublingually, or he just has tolerance to it. A 10 drop dose did nothing at all sublingually. But he did have 10 drops the day before. But still, it should do SOMETHING. So I’m included to believe it doesn’t work at all sublingually. It did make the mouth numb, but that’s from the tiny amount of methyl eugenol in the oil.
Ok well... swim did it subligually today too... and nothing really, tolerance too perhaps.
Must say though last night was enjoyable... kinda felt like it came in a slow wave, with a long platue... I am trying to put my finger on what it reminds me of... sort of like DOM kinda... maybe a low dose of MDMA but with out the empathogenic effects.
hmmmm it hard to look back that far...
Must say though last night was enjoyable... kinda felt like it came in a slow wave, with a long platue... I am trying to put my finger on what it reminds me of... sort of like DOM kinda... maybe a low dose of MDMA but with out the empathogenic effects.
hmmmm it hard to look back that far...
69ron
Esteemed member
Like DOM? SWIM has had DOM before, being sold on blotter as LSD, but the dose was very high. It was NO FUN AT ALL. It lasted 3 whole days, was not that visual, and caused lots of disorientation. But maybe at a smaller dose it would have been nice. Also the fact that SWIM thought it was LSD to find out it wasn't AFTER he ingested it pissed him off for several hours into the trip, so I’m sure that gave the trip a negative vibe. The main negative was it lasted SO LONG. No sleep for 3 whole days. Just awful.
Mescaline and MDMA feel very similar at small doses, so I could see that parallel with Elemi oil. It wasn’t particularly empathogenic for SWIM, but it felt very social nonetheless (unlike LSD).
Mescaline and MDMA feel very similar at small doses, so I could see that parallel with Elemi oil. It wasn’t particularly empathogenic for SWIM, but it felt very social nonetheless (unlike LSD).
Damn yeh... that sucks... lots of people where getting DOM at rainbow gatherings sold to them as mescaline years ago... sad... but if your goign to trip for that long thats the place to do it i guess. lol
SWIMS DOM was a small dose and it was perfection. It is a shame people have had such hard ones with it. My comparison lays with the decreased visual aspect and increase mental and body high aspect. a low dose of Mescaline could be also considered.
Yeah not empathogenic but definitely increase socialization, feel pretty refreshed and cleansed... thats good. still kinda felt it a little when SWIM woke up too...
SWIMS DOM was a small dose and it was perfection. It is a shame people have had such hard ones with it. My comparison lays with the decreased visual aspect and increase mental and body high aspect. a low dose of Mescaline could be also considered.
Yeah not empathogenic but definitely increase socialization, feel pretty refreshed and cleansed... thats good. still kinda felt it a little when SWIM woke up too...
69ron
Esteemed member
So far every new Elemi trip report looks positive. There are no negative reports yet. But they are all low dose reports.
It’s being compared with low doses of decent psychedelics too: mescaline, acid, DOM, MDMA.
Everyone is using oil from different suppliers too, and it all seems to be fairly active.
There isn’t a single “legal highs” text I’ve ever seen that talks about using Elemi oil.
How did Elemi oil manage to remain so obscure?
It’s being compared with low doses of decent psychedelics too: mescaline, acid, DOM, MDMA.
Everyone is using oil from different suppliers too, and it all seems to be fairly active.
There isn’t a single “legal highs” text I’ve ever seen that talks about using Elemi oil.
How did Elemi oil manage to remain so obscure?