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Non Internet source for fumaric acid
- Thread starter blueskine
- Start date
It's sometimes used in winemaking
well its not suspicious to order online.. or is there another reason why you dont order ?
Fumaric acid is a bit of a bugger to get at the best of times even more so in the smaller quantities that we want it. In the UK Fumaric is damn near impossible to get ( at the moment I know of only two people who sell it in low quantities - and they have to buy it in bulk). It is very rarely used in winemaking and I have never seen it for sale in any winemaker shop or website.
It is easier just to order it online.
It is easier just to order it online.
I recommend the guy on ebay.co.uk
balaganist
Rising Star
yes ebay seems to be the way to go with this stuff...
Yes, it's used for treating psoriasis and available in capsule form, but often as an ester of fumaric acid. Psorex is one such brand. I don’t think you can use it because it’s not pure fumaric acid, even though the jar makes it look like it is. If you read the fine print, it contains an ester of fumaric acid.
My psoriasis acts up bad and I take this. It says it has no "extras" except for the veggie capsule. Is it still the ester? Would it be suspicious to ask the supplier if the acid is actually the ester? There is no mention of ester on the bottle.
LawnBoy said:
It would not be suspicious. Fumaric acid is not known for use in anything other than cooking, wine making, and health food products. Just act concerned that you're getting the real thing. Say something like, "I always like to know what exactly I'm putting into my body. I've heard some of these products contain fumaric acid esters but don’t make that clear on the label. Does this contain an ester? I'm not sure if I want to ingest that or not."
They with either have no idea or be very helpful. I think most health care professionals would be happy to get a question like that. It shows you’re concerned with what exactly you put into your body.
As the others have stated, I know it's available at health stores, and also at specialty / ethnic cooking supply stores. I've even seen it at well stocked farmers market / green grocery stores too.
Additionally, if you have a chemistry / lab supply shop in your area they should definitely have it. Like 69 said, there is nothing suspicious about it.
Unless you're completely opposed to buying on line, you can get it from Flowing Visions (or at least the used to carry it).
Maybe we should start a Nexus canning and health food store! JK :lol:
NOTE and Question for everyone here: In cooking, tartaric acid (cream of tartar, which can be found at any grocery) can be used as a substitute for fumaric acid @ a 3 parts tartaric acid in place of every 2 parts of fumaric that is called for. Does anyone know if / why tartaric couldn't be substituted?
Peace,
-idt
Additionally, if you have a chemistry / lab supply shop in your area they should definitely have it. Like 69 said, there is nothing suspicious about it.
Unless you're completely opposed to buying on line, you can get it from Flowing Visions (or at least the used to carry it).
Maybe we should start a Nexus canning and health food store! JK :lol:
NOTE and Question for everyone here: In cooking, tartaric acid (cream of tartar, which can be found at any grocery) can be used as a substitute for fumaric acid @ a 3 parts tartaric acid in place of every 2 parts of fumaric that is called for. Does anyone know if / why tartaric couldn't be substituted?
Peace,
-idt
Sorry for the blatant 'bump', but I'm still curious if anyone can answer this question...
idtravlr said:
'unbump'
In cooking, since they are just using the acid for tartness, it doesn’t much matter if you substitute tartaric acid for fumaric acid. But in chemistry, it can matter quite a lot.
The properties of fumaric acid are unique. It's one of the very few non-hygroscopic acids in existence. Tartaric acid, like most other acids, is hydroscopic, meaning it absorbs water from the air.
DMT tartrate is very hydroscopic and becomes a sticky goo pretty fast. The same with DMT citrate and DMT HCl.
DMT fumarate is a dry powder.
So if you want a dry powder, fumaric acid is your best option.
When it comes to a tech that uses precipitation, the acid used is often very important. For example, mescaline HCl will precipitate from xylene, but mescaline fumarate won’t. Also, DMT fumarate will precipitate from acetone easily, but DMT citrate has a hard time precipitating from acetone.
In cooking, since they are just using the acid for tartness, it doesn’t much matter if you substitute tartaric acid for fumaric acid. But in chemistry, it can matter quite a lot.
The properties of fumaric acid are unique. It's one of the very few non-hygroscopic acids in existence. Tartaric acid, like most other acids, is hydroscopic, meaning it absorbs water from the air.
DMT tartrate is very hydroscopic and becomes a sticky goo pretty fast. The same with DMT citrate and DMT HCl.
DMT fumarate is a dry powder.
So if you want a dry powder, fumaric acid is your best option.
When it comes to a tech that uses precipitation, the acid used is often very important. For example, mescaline HCl will precipitate from xylene, but mescaline fumarate won’t. Also, DMT fumarate will precipitate from acetone easily, but DMT citrate has a hard time precipitating from acetone.
Ahhh... That actually clears things up quite a bit. It makes sense that a "hydroscopic" acid would result in a "wetter" end result, or a less "precipitable" acetate due to the attached H20 molecules (I'm assuming I'm understanding this correctly).69ron said:
With that said, could the water be eventually evaped off, or is it permanently bound to the acid once the molecules attach? This question is more or less just trying to understand the chemistry of it all.
Thanks again for sharing your wisdome Lord Psychedelic Jesus!
Thanks for the "unbump"!Peace!
-idt
idtravlr said:Ahhh... That actually clears things up quite a bit. It makes sense that a "hydroscopic" acid would result in a "wetter" end result, or a less "precipitable" acetate due to the attached H20 molecules (I'm assuming I'm understanding this correctly).69ron said:
With that said, could the water be eventually evaped off, or is it permanently bound to the acid once the molecules attach? This question is more or less just trying to understand the chemistry of it all.
Thanks again for sharing your wisdome Lord Psychedelic Jesus!
Peace!
-idt
Oh man, there's that "Psychedelic Jesus" again...ok...so yes, you can evaporate off the water, but as soon as the salt is exposed to air that's not completely dry, it soaks up the water again from the air.
DMT HCl can be made dry, and it will form crystals, as long as the air is dry. This can be done in a desiccator. But as soon as you open up the desiccator it starts getting wet again. You can actually see it happen in front of your eyes if the air is wet enough.
Some “wet” salts like harmaline are not sticky. When you extract harmaline HCl, it normally forms as harmaline HCl dihydrate. It’s not wet looking or sticky, but does have water attached to it. If you heat it at a high enough temperature it becomes dry losing its water forming harmaline HCl. But it will eventually either regain the water from the air or oxidize it if doesn’t.
I believe DMT HCl is actually DMT HCl dihydrate when it’s a sticky goo, but a crystal when it’s DMT HCl. Most DMT salts absorb water and become either a monohydrate or a dihydrate. DMT furmarate doesn’t attract water at all. DMT fumarate is actually DMT+fumarate+DMT, with no place for the water to attach.
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