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~Phalaris = The Way Of The Future~

Migrated topic.
^..i second that Sidisheikh.mehriz's point still stands..

..that really old post was from a time when there was a threat to some availability through law enforcement..supply chains are not guaranteed..self-sustainability or localised growing is always the safest long term bet..

and if we favour a growing it yourself model, then trees like mimosa and confusa can't be grown easily or at all in colder climates, or for people who live in urban environments, or don't own land..

Phalaris can be grown in tub conditions (in smaller spaces), and will grow to yield in faster time scales than trees..

when we go back to an early post in this thread (like widderic quoted), what we're seeing is the development and progress of ideas and data by the nexus collaboration...back in 2010-11 there were aspects of Phalaris that were not clear to nexians...we see in the the thread perfectly how various members worked together to find more answers on Phalaris...and now we see really developed, successful and ongoing cultivar work with the grasses..

we're now in the future, from the point-of-view of the early thread...and still learning and progressing
 
dithyramb said:
Brachystachys doesnt seem to be a species that takes over ime. Aquatica germinates more aggressively but still does not dominate ime. Arundinacea, with which I do not have exprience, is said to take over.
Click to expand...

Brachystachys dosen't pose an invasive threat where you are located Dithy because that's it's original habitat where it has other species competing with it for space ..this. Related a balance.

When you introduce brachys to places where the usual competing species aren't around brachys will definitely take over and aggressively.

There is even a study in the USA to estimate the thread of brachystachys as a weed and they have mentioned in this paper people trying to bring the seeds over for recreational use of the plant..

Even governments are aware of this
 
İt is native to the wider geographical area but it's not like it grows everywhere in every habitat. In my current region in its wild form I found it in rare numbers and wherever İ grew it, it never spread more than a few tiny grasses around the pots. At least with this strain, it can spread but does not give the impression of an aggressive, hardy dominator plant at all.
 
Agronomic researchers in crop science especially cereals would highly disagree. Some strains if brachystachys resist the most potent pesticides and was declared in Turkey and Iran I shown you the price of research
 
I never said anything about how brachystachys behaves in agricultural field environments. That specific artificial environment may be extremely favorable for this species. I told you that once in a distant city I saw a field full of brachystachys. Outside of that environment brachystachys does not show infestation behavior, period. Being resistant to pesticides can make a plant a winner in an agricultural field as it is left with very little competition, but means nothing in wild or natural environments.
 
nen888 said:
^..i second that Sidisheikh.mehriz's point still stands..

..that really old post was from a time when there was a threat to some availability through law enforcement..supply chains are not guaranteed..self-sustainability or localised growing is always the safest long term bet..

and if we favour a growing it yourself model, then trees like mimosa and confusa can't be grown easily or at all in colder climates, or for people who live in urban environments, or don't own land..

Phalaris can be grown in tub conditions (in smaller spaces), and will grow to yield in faster time scales than trees..

when we go back to an early post in this thread (like widderic quoted), what we're seeing is the development and progress of ideas and data by the nexus collaboration...back in 2010-11 there were aspects of Phalaris that were not clear to nexians...we see in the the thread perfectly how various members worked together to find more answers on Phalaris...and now we see really developed, successful and ongoing cultivar work with the grasses..

we're now in the future, from the point-of-view of the early thread...and still learning and progressing
Click to expand...

In my experience grass dosen't just grow faster. Aquatica actually yielded better than acacia acuminate in my experience. I tried the phyllodes and twigs then branch and trunk bark. Grass also surpassed bredgesii for me yeaild wise in fresh weight. Last Extract yesterday was quiet potent and magical. That was less than two weeks worth of regrowth.

For people thinking grass is the poor man's tryptamine they would be wrong. 350g fresh regrowth in like 12 days yeilding something around 300mg.

I also came upon a very interesting paper which I posted on phalaris project thread on aphids infestation in aquatica altering it's alkaloid profile (it lowers gramine by 80% and increases DMT and 5meo DMT by 91% and 146% respectively. More interestingly silicon supplementation to aquatica in the abscence of aphids Increases 5 meo DMT in holdfast cultivar by a whopping 800% in a hydroponic system.

These aphids are considered the fastest Insect reproduction wise in favourable conditions it can complete one reproduction cycle in 3 weeks only. This aphid Infestation was accidental since I thrown a rotten pomegranate fruit in the garden.

How come no one has caught up on this?!
 
dithyramb said:
I never said anything about how brachystachys behaves in agricultural field environments. That specific artificial environment may be extremely favorable for this species. I told you that once in a distant city I saw a field full of brachystachys. Outside of that environment brachystachys does not show infestation behavior, period. Being resistant to pesticides can make a plant a winner in an agricultural field as it is left with very little competition, but means nothing in wild or natural environments.
Click to expand...

This might be your observation and am not questioning it. But in my garden brachystachys has outcompeted aquatica even though aquatica has by far larger seedlings. They hardly grow as fast as aquatica yet somehow they inhibit its growth and choke it and takes iver.
 
hey friends 😁

swix has previously grown phalaris in soil and soil/flood and drain hybrid systems with varying success
this has led swix to setup a simple nft channel hydroponics system with 9x phalaris brac plugs to trial in the hopes that fine tuning various growth & enviromental controls will lead to a way better "Way Of The Future"

the internet seems to be filled with lots of information pertaining to grams per hectare, meter, per 6 weeks dosages :shock: etc but nothing specific to hydroponic conditions for phalaris nor similar grass plants or even standard turf/lawn or grass in hydroponic systems
the closest information found so far is hydroponic wheatgrass but that seems to just grow regardless of a nutrient program

some help, answers, advice and speculation would be appreciated with the questions below in relation to growing phalaris hydroponically

questions-
what ppm should would one be aiming at for ammonium sulfate for growth phase?
what ppm should would one be aiming at for ammonium sulfate for stress phase?
what is optimal water ph for grasses ?
what ppfd umol(light intensity) is optimal for growth ?
what ppfd umol(light intensity) is optimal for shadey conditions ?
what is the optimal amount of time to not water the grass to induce water stress ?
do the plants respond to UVA/UVB lighting ?
do the plants respond to far-red/ infrared lighting ?
are the desirerable alkaloids an essential oil ? > would the plants benefit from a product like cyco super stiky? (an essential oil enhancer)
would there be possible benefits to cycling nitrogren sources ? ammnonium sulfate, nitrate, urea, calcium nitrate etc
would the plants benefit from a balanced nutrient program ? similar to A+B noot programs for most plants

phalaris is a very neato plant and if this goes well swix may take this information into a new thread with build, grow & 'omg the future' log
TIA
 
borris_yeltzun...if you can fine tune these parameters, for hydroponic growing, the future of Phalaris for many, truly beckons...that work, in conjunction with the strain selection being done by other nexians here, will nail it...for generations to come..
 
Super excited to announce I have gotten my hands on a Big Medicine clone and it has just got over it's initial transplant shock and has begun making new shoots left and right. When I got this, it was turning brown and wilting, and root bound to a comical degree. It's in a 5 gallon pot right now, and I'll probably migrate to a 20 gallon pot when it's growth slows. Also going to try to propogate this clone in my local area.

I'm the meantime I'm working on learning to identify phalaris and I think I have some growing in my backyard which I will post here for identification when it goes to seed.
 

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borris_yeltzun said:
hey friends 😁

swix has previously grown phalaris in soil and soil/flood and drain hybrid systems with varying success
this has led swix to setup a simple nft channel hydroponics system with 9x phalaris brac plugs to trial in the hopes that fine tuning various growth & enviromental controls will lead to a way better "Way Of The Future"

the internet seems to be filled with lots of information pertaining to grams per hectare, meter, per 6 weeks dosages :shock: etc but nothing specific to hydroponic conditions for phalaris nor similar grass plants or even standard turf/lawn or grass in hydroponic systems
the closest information found so far is hydroponic wheatgrass but that seems to just grow regardless of a nutrient program

some help, answers, advice and speculation would be appreciated with the questions below in relation to growing phalaris hydroponically

questions-
what ppm should would one be aiming at for ammonium sulfate for growth phase?
what ppm should would one be aiming at for ammonium sulfate for stress phase?
what is optimal water ph for grasses ?
what ppfd umol(light intensity) is optimal for growth ?
what ppfd umol(light intensity) is optimal for shadey conditions ?
what is the optimal amount of time to not water the grass to induce water stress ?
do the plants respond to UVA/UVB lighting ?
do the plants respond to far-red/ infrared lighting ?
are the desirerable alkaloids an essential oil ? > would the plants benefit from a product like cyco super stiky? (an essential oil enhancer)
would there be possible benefits to cycling nitrogren sources ? ammnonium sulfate, nitrate, urea, calcium nitrate etc
would the plants benefit from a balanced nutrient program ? similar to A+B noot programs for most plants

phalaris is a very neato plant and if this goes well swix may take this information into a new thread with build, grow & 'omg the future' log
TIA
Click to expand...

Here's a paper on aquatica grown in a hydroponic system.
 

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My Big Medicine clone was coming along nicely until early this week. There is some yellowing that is starting to occur. Is there a good resource for phalaris care?
 

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Jacubey said:
My Big Medicine clone was coming along nicely until early this week. There is some yellowing that is starting to occur. Is there a good resource for phalaris care?
Click to expand...

Phalaris will start yellowing and getting sick when not harvested for a long time even when conditions are favourable.

When I harvested from aquatica it always regained vigour. Too many harvests will make it loose vigour once again. Removing the older leaves that are starting to yellow is good enough for now if you're not planning on harvesting. Maybe take out some younger leaves that are just starting to show signs of wilting.
 
Thank you for the suggestions! I've pruned the yellowing leaves for now. I'm considering doing a harvest but IIRC you should put the plant through some drought/stress it first. I also wonder if I should put it in a larger pot. Still room in this one for growth but with how much bigger its gotten in just a month I can't imagine it'll fit much longer.
 
I'd say avoid water stressing for now and use other stressors to compensate water stress like high nitrogen and partial shading.

Shading spikes tryptamine regardless of nitrogen fertilization. This way you hit two birds with one stone; you get to make one harvest for testing and still manage to get some seeds and new clones.

Use a silicon fertilizer preferably choline stabilized orthosillic acid it's the most stable and bioavailable form of silicon supplementation.

I will attach the PDF for silicon effect on phalaris secondary metabolites. I spoken about this topic on phalaris project in details. In a nutshell aquatica CV holdfast grown in hydroponic supplemented with stabilized orthosillic acid resulted in 800% 5-meo-dmt increase and 60% decrease in gramine.

Aphids infestation is also another efficient stressor. It boosts both DMT and 5-meo-dmt

This topic needs a thread of it's own and more participants. If you can't find orthosillic acid, steel mill slug is good alternative for silicon. Silicon works by regulating the plant stress hormone which consequently effects the grass secondary metabolites.
 
Arudinacea has more robust root system that goes deeper into soil so probably you should probably transplant to a deeper pot. Don't wait in it to become root bound it will stunt growth for sure. Periods of vigorous growth is what you're aiming for for high alkaloids. It's that new chlorophillous tissue where most the alkaloids at.
 

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Heh. I had aphids until I unleashed an army of ladybugs out there.

Boosting 5-meo content sounds dangerous, unless there's an easy way to separate DMT from 5-meo-dmt

I think I'll stress it, let it seed, harvest, and then re-pot after recovery. Maybe also separate some rhizomes to smaller pots to spread the grows out. When phalaris self-seeds, how does that effect the genetics? I'd imagine the child plants would likely not have the alkaloid profile of my clone.

I think a separate phalaris care thread would be great, or maybe even a phalaris care wiki page. I initally put off getting started with phalaris because of how disjoint all the information was.

Also, I think you forgot to attach the PDF
 
Sorry got busy. It's attached now.
5-meo-dmt dosen't have to be dangerous if smoked. I very much prefer it over DMT actually. As the dominant alkaloid in a cocktail of tryptamines 5 is even more magical.

I'd say harvest first before it starts making seeds as biomass decrease after anthesis. Do the cloning part also before anthesis. You want to catch the grass at the peak of its growth when cloning. Otherwise most of that growth vigour will be directed towards making seeds.

Just grow seeds In a different spot separately from clones? It's not practical to just waste seeds whether they turn out true to their parent clone, have a different interesting profile, be toxic or yields nothing at all it's an adventure.

Extract it and if it yields something send that for analysis and then if it's worth its salt give it a chance for a bioassay. You would have a while new patch of active grass.

I neglected my cultivar for a whole year thinking there's very little chance it could contain something of interest since it's a commercial cultivar. Then it blew my mind.
 
so after some time simon has had some success with the grow,

things observed and noted

*old seeds germinate really fast after an overnight soak in gibberillic acid (ga3) solution > fresh seeds germinate within a week

* sowing ontop of rockwool covered with single layer of fine hydroponic silica rock appears to germ fastest (perfect light penetration/ darkness ratio) ???

*germination @ a constant 24 degrees works well

*the use of water set to ph 6.2 seems appears to grow fastest

* infant plants appear to tolerate high ec nutrients (2.2)

* cutting the new leaves @ 10cm even when thin helps the plant fill the net cups with new growth

* cut leaves appear to continue to grow in length and width, so regular 3 day trims are a must for expansion

* cloning the plant is easiest if you grow a net cup almost all the way to the edges of the cup and slice the rockwool & plant down the middle into two pieces, divide and repot > expand

*half ammonium sulfate / half 9-5-30 nutes @ 2.2 ec grow quick 5g each into 20L

*plants can take a buttload of light 650 ppfd over 18hrs is well tolerate and even more might be required

*chelated iron, kelp and ortho silica work well

* roots will most likely fill nft @ some point, they have quite a beard for such a young age
 

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