TEK "TnT tek" - Vodka DMT extraction for oral use TEK (super easy!)

[Pyramids]

Hi Northape! Appreciate the reply.

It's not the best admixture for an oral brew

Would you mind expanding on this a bit?

and is better used at low-to-mid doses.
You can get into very mentally unsafe territory with mimosa at higher doses.

And this?

I haven't heard this yet and I'm quite new to mimosa, have more experience using chakruna. Appreciated!

EDITED: and fwiw. I created my first changa a few weeks ago (using black caapi). I need to modify the next batch to see if i can extend the duration beyond 5 minutes, but the experience itself is just perfect. I did about an hour long session the other day, hitting the bong rather aggressively every 10 minutes. The resultant level of experience is what I'm trying to replicate now via oral administration. My lungs don't love the smoke.

 

[blig-blug]

I need to modify the next batch to see if i can extend the duration beyond 5 minutes

Does it have any more harmalas than black caapi? Is it extracted caapi? If it lasts 5 minutes, it sounds more like "enhanced leaf" with DMT only (and residual levels of harmalas in this case) than changa.

It's hard to get the same level of sustained intensity from an oral brew as from a breakthrough-level dose of smoked DMT. Particularly if you count as intensity how fast everything happens with DMT. Harmalas invariably slow it down quite a bit, plus adding their own effects. They're just two different experiences.

 

[Pyramids]

Does it have any more harmalas than black caapi? Is it extracted caapi? If it lasts 5 minutes, it sounds more like "enhanced leaf" with DMT only (and residual levels of harmalas in this case) than changa.

It's hard to get the same level of sustained intensity from an oral brew as from a breakthrough-level dose of smoked DMT. Particularly if you count as intensity how fast everything happens with DMT. Harmalas invariably slow it down quite a bit, plus adding their own effects. They're just two different experiences.

I soaked my 1g leaf mix in ISO + an ethanol extraction of caapi (10x) and 1g dmt

I hear that. I'm not necessarily expecting the intensity to line up exactly, in fact that would be really challenging to maintain: it was like my consciousness was running through a delay pedal that had been set to extremely fast with infinite feedback

but the depth of the experience, i guess. something i have felt before with oral aya.

 

[blig-blug]

I soaked my 1g leaf mix in ISO + an ethanol extraction of caapi (10x) and 1g dmt

Assuming that extract is 10x in harmalas too (which needn't be the case, commercially available extracts are unreliable), that means the extract will be about 4% harmalas. That's still less than (unextracted) Syrian rue seeds. [EDIT: it really depends, it could conceivably be about 20% or more, but still unlikely to be enough, particularly if your experiences are so short] So it's indeed enhanced leaf more than changa, and so the effects are those of smoked DMT. Not that it's a problem, but be aware that pure, smoked DMT and oral brews are quite different in effects. Changa is also different, but closer to oral brews than enhanced leaf is. And that's also the reason it only lasts a few minutes, as pure DMT does.

If you don't want to add more harmalas to your leaf, you can take some oral Syrian rue, caapi or harmalas (those can be sublingual too if pure) about half an hour before smoking. That should be much closer in effects to changa, and longer lasting.

in fact that would be really challenging to maintain

Yes, I agree with that, being in such a strong experience for several hours would be quite challenging.

but the depth of the experience, i guess. something i have felt before with oral aya.

I would up the caapi first with your oral brew. If that's not enough, up the TnT dose. And remember you can always redose, the second dose tends to be stronger and qualitatively more profound than the first.

 

[Pyramids]

Assuming that extract is 10x in harmalas too (which needn't be the case, commercially available extracts are unreliable),

i extracted it myself, but either way that all makes sense. The experience was like the very best of moments i've had taking aya that I generally have only reached with consecutive day experiences. Now i can get there whenever i want but only for 5 minutes at a time . I'll double the caapi next time. I'll likely do the same for the next oral TnT experience. Appreciate the insights.

 

[northape]

Hi Northape! Appreciate the reply.
Would you mind expanding on this a bit?
And this?
I haven't heard this yet and I'm quite new to mimosa, have more experience using chakruna. Appreciated!

EDITED: and fwiw. I created my first changa a few weeks ago (using black caapi). I need to modify the next batch to see if i can extend the duration beyond 5 minutes, but the experience itself is just perfect. I did about an hour long session the other day, hitting the bong rather aggressively every 10 minutes. The resultant level of experience is what I'm trying to replicate now via oral administration. My lungs don't love the smoke.

Mimosa is more suited for extraction than oral use, imo. There are many factors involved, and it's not a traditional medicine for a reason. There is no evidence that anyone used it with maoi before modern times, from what I know. Barks in general are much harsher on the body compared to other admixtures. You can feel it yourself if you work with them for a while.

Mimosa tea has a stimulating effect, tannins, and other goodies besides DMT. Then there is the spirit of this plant. You can get all kinds of gory visions in the most sharp, in-your-face representation. Mimosa isn't concerned with your emotions or how much you can take. It's a harsh teacher that will show you the truth even if it breaks you. That is the good kind of mimosa. Some barks on the market are altogether witchy, and you can find yourself in a hellish carnival unable to get out. What it does on a subconscious level is questionable too.

I'd only use it at levels where I can be fully present and attend to what is going on. It's not a plant to delve into and let go. It's possible, but there are other, safer options like chaliponga or chacruna. I don't mean to scare you, but just know what you are signing up for. At mid-range doses, it could be a fine admixture to a harmala-dominant brew. I found that mimosa shines when it comes to protection. If you can go through the lesson, it will cleanse you and create a shield against negativity. Mimosa forcefully cuts all the stuff that does not serve you and scares away mental parasites. However, you need a strong practice, solid intention, a firm stance, and faith in something to succeed.

All of this is my experience with oral mimosa & rue use. We all differ, but you cannot remove the vibe of any given plant. Just know what you are working with.

 

[taita]

Ok, so I have a question. I'm guessing @Transform can answer it, but perhaps someone else can say as well. I am performing a small version of this tek with Gleditsia Triacanthos trunk bark. The separation layer that forms after adding the calcium hydroxide is composed of what, exactly? I mean to say, does the formation of a separation layer necessarily indicate the presence of spice, or is it reflective of whatever alkaloids are present in the original plant material, or what exactly is that layer composed of in general?

Perhaps this question has been answered elsewhere, and I'm sure it's a reflection of my ignorance of chemistry, but what exactly is happening when a tincture is basified and this separation layer forms? Is the base just binding the tannins, or what exactly is happening?

 

[Pyramids]

@northape appreciate the in-depth response! I don't generally have any anxiety about mental experience/load. I'm pretty well up for anything (well, so far :wink). It's the body load that gets me. It will be helpful to know that in advance, though, in case things do go annihilation mode on me. I will proceed with caution.

 

[blig-blug]

I mean to say, does the formation of a separation layer necessarily indicate the presence of spice, or is it reflective of whatever alkaloids are present in the original plant material, or what exactly is that layer composed of in general?

The layer just means that calcium hydroxide (and calcium carbonate, calcium tannate, etc. if they formed) aren't soluble in water or ethanol and so they decant. It doesn't mean that there's DMT in the plant.

AFAIK the layer should contain whatever alkaloids are present in the plant and were extracted by the vodka originally. In TnT, the extraction itself happens when soaking in vodka. The addition of calcium hydroxide is just meant to remove tannins.

 

[northape]

@northape appreciate the in-depth response! I don't generally have any anxiety about mental experience/load. I'm pretty well up for anything (well, so far :wink). It's the body load that gets me. It will be helpful to know that in advance, though, in case things do go annihilation mode on me. I will proceed with caution.

Mimosa is pretty safe body-wise. Just don't jump into deep waters right away and you should be fine.

 

[taita]

The layer just means that calcium hydroxide (and calcium carbonate, calcium tannate, etc. if they formed) aren't soluble in water or ethanol and so they decant. It doesn't mean that there's DMT in the plant.

AFAIK the layer should contain whatever alkaloids are present in the plant and were extracted by the vodka originally. In TnT, the extraction itself happens when soaking in vodka. The addition of calcium hydroxide is just meant to remove tannins.

Excellent, thank you for the detailed response blig. Appreciate you

 

[Transform]

Ok, so I have a question. I'm guessing @Transform can answer it, but perhaps someone else can say as well. I am performing a small version of this tek with Gleditsia Triacanthos trunk bark. The separation layer that forms after adding the calcium hydroxide is composed of what, exactly? I mean to say, does the formation of a separation layer necessarily indicate the presence of spice, or is it reflective of whatever alkaloids are present in the original plant material, or what exactly is that layer composed of in general?

What @blig-blug said^^

Is the base just binding the tannins, or what exactly is happening?

Largely this, plus virtually all alkaloid molecules will get deprotonated, whatever they may be, and assuming there are any. Phenolic alkaloids like bufotenine would also lose their phenolic proton, so that may or may not cause co-precipitation with the tannins, although it seems more likely than not. This is merely an example, btw - I'm not suggesting anything about the presence or absence of bufotenine in Gleditsia triacanthos!

 

[Transform]

The smell is part vodka, along with another smell I'm not familiar with (I wouldn't call it a sweet smell, kinda has a chemical smell to it). How would you all describe what the smell should be?

I'd go for jasmine as the main fragrance note besides vodka. Some people say "new sneakers" for a general nearly totally pure DMT smell, which I'd understand to be pretty much the same thing.

You won't detect a scent of calcium hydroxide in solution as it's completely non-volatile. It may cause chemical changes in other substances from the bark, causing them to contribute unusual aroma notes if any of the reaction products are volatile.

I think I will try this with the sodium carbonate as @Transform suggested

This treatment, intended for water-immiscible solvents, doesn't apply to ethanol solutions containing calcium hydroxide - you will form insoluble calcium carbonate, and leave sodium hydroxide in solution.

Instead, you can lower the pH with the sparing use of any food grade acid. I'd suggest ascorbic acid, or just vinegar or even lemon juice. You'll only need a few drops per dose.

 

[Pyramids]

For those of us using ethanol—especially for the solvent-stealing caapi—i just wanted to mention my recent experience. I live on an island so prices are pretty steep and the alcohol tax scenario is outrageous. I was paying $145/gallon for 195-proof. I checked out some off-island distilleries and made a connection and now i'm paying $15/gallon for 191-proof. At least in my location it costs about $10/gallon to produce for reference. So, the deal I got was kindof an extreme example but the markup is insane. This whole dang country has gotten this way, especially in the wake of the pandemic. "we are all in this together" turned into "we are all ripping each other off together."

 

[TransistorBass]

For those of us using ethanol—especially for the solvent-stealing caapi—i just wanted to mention my recent experience. I live on an island so prices are pretty steep and the alcohol tax scenario is outrageous. I was paying $145/gallon for 195-proof. I checked out some off-island distilleries and made a connection and now i'm paying $15/gallon for 191-proof. At least in my location it costs about $10/gallon to produce for reference. So, the deal I got was kindof an extreme example but the markup is insane. This whole dang country has gotten this way, especially in the wake of the pandemic. "we are all in this together" turned into "we are all ripping each other off together."

Our 'Captors' have to make their mountains of money some how, how would they survive global warming as the ice caps melt and sea levels rise if they aren't sat atop their massive mound of worthless gold and cash?! Short-Sighted-Fools, the lot of them.

 

[taita]

For those of us using ethanol—especially for the solvent-stealing caapi—i just wanted to mention my recent experience. I live on an island so prices are pretty steep and the alcohol tax scenario is outrageous. I was paying $145/gallon for 195-proof. I checked out some off-island distilleries and made a connection and now i'm paying $15/gallon for 191-proof. At least in my location it costs about $10/gallon to produce for reference. So, the deal I got was kindof an extreme example but the markup is insane. This whole dang country has gotten this way, especially in the wake of the pandemic. "we are all in this together" turned into "we are all ripping each other off together."

You can get an alcohol still for around $100 and be self sufficient... I make a lot of tinctures/extracts in general and might go this route before long. would be nice to save on the monthly everclear bill lol

 

[Pyramids]

You can get an alcohol still for around $100 and be self sufficient... I make a lot of tinctures/extracts in general and might go this route before long. would be nice to save on the monthly everclear bill lol

yeah for sure, iI've looked into distilling a bit but most of my ethanol is going towards caapi extraction which seems to be best around 150-proof and my understanding there is that you need pretty specialized equipment to get that pure (?)... Most of the other tinctures i make are even higher proof.

 

[taita]

yeah for sure, iI've looked into distilling a bit but most of my ethanol is going towards caapi extraction which seems to be best around 150-proof and my understanding there is that you need pretty specialized equipment to get that pure (?)... Most of the other tinctures i make are even higher proof.

I could be mistaken, and someone should definitely correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe you can just run it through the still multiple times and the proof will get higher. That's where we get the old school XXX for high proof alcohol, because it's been run through the still three times. But I don't really know, as I don't have a still, but I've got a buddy who has one and he was explaining it to me, and he was saying he could make as high a proof as he wanted to, but he had fractionation columns and such, so maybe you need one of those.

I too prefer high proof for tincturing