Why the bad trip?

[Acaterpillar]

Should a distinction perhaps be made between this bad/uncomfortable trip as compared with the "brujeria attack" kinds of experiences. Uncomfortable experiences have become remarkably easy for me to let go through, and come out relatively unscathed. There have been however a number of experiences I've had this past year in particular where these malicious, disfigured entities (they're akin to comparing healthy cell formation with cancerous cell formation) will touch me, and surrendering or letting go doesn't seem to be so much the point. These things feel different than being touched by other entities. They're sticky and they feel like they can get stuck in me, and all feeling and emotions instantly become negative with often a menacing sort of musico-telepathic dissonant rhythm (reminds me of the wizard music from Mario). I'm not sure if these experiences should be separated out from one another. I don't find it to be an issue of control so much. I have no problem relinquishing complete control over to other entities (even though I'm ultimately unsure of their intentions as well), but these things...I just don't know.

I was going to speak on this.
While the entities I have encountered do not fit the description, they are certainly malicious in nature.
Almost all of my difficult trips have been a result of these entities.
In fact, my last 4 DMT experiences have been incredibly frightening because of one malevolent entity who seems to be following me around.

I've always had good self confidence. The ability to surrender to whatever terrifying implications a trip may hold.
But sometimes that is not enough. Sometimes you can be overwhelmed by a dark and heavy energy that makes your entire body feel like it is trying to crawl out of it's skin.
The best thing you can do is accept what you are experiencing and just go with it.

Words to live by:
Anicca...anicca...anicca.

 

[olympus mon]

I no longer feel empathy for a person having a hard ride. In fact i feel happy for them. if they are able to integrate the experience and work through pains the person will be much better for having such an experience.

Integration, presuming it happens at all, tends to happen significantly after the fact. You are a Nexus moderator and you feel no empathy for a person having a hard ride . . . . . People having a difficult psychedelic experience are in extremis of the moment and can benefit from a number of things, empathy being among them.

I'll tell you if I came into chat and was having my metaphysical behind kicked, I wouldn't take it very well if you took a tough love (or worse) approach at that moment. In fact, speaking personally, I'd have trouble seeing beyond the immediate situation, much less be able to work at that time towards integration.

I have done a lot of lay counseling for people in the extremis of dealing with a difficult psychedelic experience or coming off a series of difficult or balls to the wall trips. For better or for worse, empathy is one of my primary tools.

:!: I wrote on my tablet and auto correct changed this to empathy when It was meant to say sympathy. Im quite sure people understood what I meant. You don't need to feel sorry for somebody to help them in fact its best to feel positive about what they are going through rather than ad to their suffering with pity.
Why don't you ask the last 2 people I've helped during a bad trip how my "tough love" was pandora. Because I see the good in hard ones doesn't make me not care about others.
Thats all Ill say so this doesn't get derailed.

 

[Botanical Bliss]

I personally believe it all comes down to fear and love. Which will you chose when that moment comes where you feel your ego being torn to pieces? My last dmt experience left me on the outside of the gate, I couldn't get thru to the other side fully. Internally I was hearing "Love yourself, let go." But at the same time I couldn't, I had doubt. Doubt in myself I think. Like many here, I don't see it as a bad trip, but more of a difficult learning experience. Just surrender to love, don't let fear take over. Difficult trips can happen because of your setting or set, as I'm sure you know.

 

[Michal_R]

Hi, this is an interesting debate, thanks for this!

...Almost all of my difficult trips have been a result of these entities...

After I learned (and experimented with) the ´proper´ set and setting, I was able to change the nature of my DMT experiences. This let me to a conclusion that it is not "the entities", but ourselves - our intentions, state of mind, expectations... - what makes a trip "good" or "bad".

Just my 2 cents.

 

[SWIMfriend]

IMO the main action of psychedelics is to ELIMINATE some brain function....

There is some evidence that may point to a reduction in brain activity, in certain areas anyway...

Be aware, I'm not taking about "reduction in brain activity," and in fact I even said the actual direct process could be an INCREASE in brain activity. My point was that it would be a DISRUPTION of "normal consciousness"--either by increased or decreased (or both) neuronal activity in certain parts of the brain.

 

[Acaterpillar]

Hi, this is an interesting debate, thanks for this!

...Almost all of my difficult trips have been a result of these entities...

After I learned (and experimented with) the ´proper´ set and setting, I was able to change the nature of my DMT experiences. This let me to a conclusion that it is not "the entities", but ourselves - our intentions, state of mind, expectations... - what makes a trip "good" or "bad".

Just my 2 cents.

Interesting.

All my experiences are almost always in the same setting. The good and bad.
I think there could be something more to it, but it would be assumptive to say for sure.

 

[DMTripper]

Fear is the only darkness

 

[Michal_R]

Interesting.

All my experiences are almost always in the same setting. The good and bad.
I think there could be something more to it, but it would be assumptive to say for sure.

I am also pretty sure that there is something more to it :thumb_up: I didn´t claim that I "got rid" of bad trips / difficult experiences. I just wanted to suggest that one can "direct" the experience by being careful about set and setting.

Most of the bad trips / difficult experiences, IMO, result from underestimating the set and setting. At least I have this impression when I am reading through various trip reports online.