69Ron's "Triple E" Tech for Elemicin Extraction from Elemi Oil

[69ron]

SWIM just tried 3ml worth of oil yesterday and he was actually very disappointed.

He drank the mix down and chased it with as much water as he could drink, then a small bowl of oatmeal.

It should be mixed with milk or something thick or the DMSO will pull the elemicin through the walls of your stomach. But I don’t this is what went wrong. It should be VERY STIMULATING if that happened.

The "trip" came on slowly, started to feel around T=1:30 and definitely went past the initial stages but when he was there it was very sedating.

It was also filled with side-effects, he had a slight headache, constant stomach discomfort and he was yawning like crazy.

This is the effect of myrcene and not elemicin. There is something definitely wrong. Elemicin is should not be at all sedating, but myrcene definitely is. Those are the effect of myrcene. Somehow it got into your extract. I wonder how.

What kind of DMSO are you using? It is somehow pulling myrcene into your product.

The whole experience lasted about 4.5 hours and he was left extremely exhausted and with a headache that went on for another 4 hours after the end of the trip.

To be honest he contemplated flushing his elemi, it was so bad.

Just a single person's trip report mind you.

That doesn’t sound like elemicin at all. It should be stimulating, not sedating, and the effects should last 8 hours, not 4. That's myrcene you're experiencing. Maybe your oil is extremely low in elemicin?

SWIM has given his oil out to several others, and a few have taken up to 4 ml extracted into DMSO, and none of them reported sedative effects. So something is definitely wrong.

Do you have a UV light? Can you check the color of your DMSO with the UV light?

What does your oil smell like? It should smell like nutmeg and roses. The nutmeg scent should be strong because that's the scent of elemicin.

 

[69ron]

q21q21, this is from another forum from a guy who took the same dose you did:

Swim had a very pleasant experience with this oil the other night. He consumed about 3ml, extracted with DMSO according to the 'Triple E' tek (his first attempt was about 1ml). He experienced a very pleasant and mildly psychedelic stimulation. Unfortunately he was in a social setting and did not keep a good record of the experience, which he plans on doing next time.

But it was, as 69Ron has said, very social. He had a great time with his friends. He also drank several beers and smoked hash, so again, this doesn't make for the ideal 'trip report', something he's been meaning to write up for the common good.

That's how it should feel. It should be stimulating, not sedating. Elemicin is not a sedative. The only potent sedative present is myrcene, and it can cause headaches, upset stomach, and other side effects like you felt. If it’s sedating, somehow the myrcene made it through the extraction. If this happens, you might want to add more water to the DMSO before using it to extract the oil. If your DMSO is pure DMSO and not 30% water, then myrcene will make it into the DMSO.

 

[69ron]

q21q21, maybe you did everything perfectly right, and all the sedating myrcene is removed, but your oil is high in eucalyptol? Eucalyptol is extracted using the Triple E tech, just as well as elemicin is. So if your oil is high in eucalyptol and low in elemicin, you will get sedative effects from it, a possible headache, and you may even feel like you can’t breath properly. It's a nasty compound. It can cause all the side effects you mentioned: "it was very sedating. It was also filled with side-effects, he had a slight headache, constant stomach discomfort and he was yawning like crazy."

Eucalyptol is something SWIM’s elemi oil is very low in (he can tell by the smell). Eucalyptus oil is mostly eucalyptol. Eucalyptol has the smell of eucalyptus.

Eucalyptol is unfortunately difficult to remove using a simple tech like this one. I’ll be working on a possible solution to this. It’s possible some elemi oil is very high in eucalyptol, and in that case the Triple E tech won’t do much good and you’ll get lots of side effects and sedation.

I need to tackle this one. Enough eucalyptol would completely ruin the experience.

 

[q21q21]

SWIM remember when he ready the reply that he didn't shake is 30/70 DMSO before adding it, would that have possible caused it because it would be just DMSO added?

 

[ms_manic_minxx]

I read somewhere that eucalyptus oil was DEATHLY TOXIC. :shock: Is that due to eucalyptol, or something else? Or incorrect information?

 

[Ginkgo]

I read somewhere that eucalyptus oil was DEATHLY TOXIC. :shock: Is that due to eucalyptol, or something else? Or incorrect information?

True, large doses of eucalyptol is toxic and may even be lethal. However, this applies to absolutely everything, including water. The potentially lethal dose for eucalyptus oil (which has 70-85% eucalyptol) is 0.05 mL to 0.5 mL per kg of body weight. For a 80 kilo adult, this means between 4 and 40 mL of eucalyptus oil. The toxic dose will be considerably higher for any variation of elemi oil, which usually have only a few percent of eucalyptol.

 

[69ron]

I read somewhere that eucalyptus oil was DEATHLY TOXIC. :shock: Is that due to eucalyptol, or something else? Or incorrect information?

True, large doses of eucalyptol is toxic and may even be lethal. However, this applies to absolutely everything, including water. The potentially lethal dose for eucalyptus oil (which has 70-85% eucalyptol) is 0.05 mL to 0.5 mL per kg of body weight. For a 80 kilo adult, this means between 4 and 40 mL of eucalyptus oil. The toxic dose will be considerably higher for any variation of elemi oil, which usually have only a few percent of eucalyptol.

Eucalyptus oil can be deadly if you take enough. Eucalyptus oil is mostly eucalyptol.

Eucalyptol is actually a serious issue with some elemi oil. Apparently some elemi oil contains more eucalyptol than elemicin. The two bottles of elemi oil that SWIM has were different. The first was more sedating. The two main sedatives present in elemi oil are myrcene and eucalyptol. The myrcene doesn’t dissolve in the 70/30 solution of DMSO/water but the eucalyptol does for sure. SWIM got lucky. Both batches seem low in eucalyptol, because after the DMSO extraction there's no sedation felt.

A way to get rid of the eucalyptol needs to be found.

SWIM has one friend who just tried this tech with a new batch of elemi oil. Her last batch was great, but with the new batch she got sedative effects, a headache, and NOTHING else. SWIM has not tried the extract, but the extract was smelled and it smelled like eucalyptus and DMSO, with a hint of roses or something like that. Not good at all. There was no nutmeg smell to it.

Does anyone have any idea of how to easily remove the eucalyptol? I read that it can be freeze precipitated out of eucalyptus oil, but this only works if there’s a ton of it present. I don’t think there’s enough in elemi oil for that to work. Any ideas?

 

[69ron]

Look at these quotes from earlier in this thread from users that didn't have such a good experience. I didn’t realize this before, but now after doing more research I can see that these breathing effects are likely caused by the eucalyptol present in the extract:

Ok, I tried the tek and took the equivalent of 4 drops. I noticed it almost immediatly after swallowing, it took no longer than 5 minutes to feel it. After 1-2 hours i felt a prickling sensation on my head and some slight nausea. It was stimulating at first but now i feel tired and not so well. It also seems to be the cause for some bronchoconstriction, having difficult times to breathe, but nothing danngerous yet, i think.

But i can say that its definatly active. Not sure if psychedelic but i feel likee im coming up on something...

it was very sedating. It was also filled with side-effects, he had a slight headache, constant stomach discomfort and he was yawning like crazy.

It also seems to be the cause for some bronchoconstriction, having difficult times to breathe, but nothing danngerous yet, i think.

I have also felt this previously and confirmed it yesterday with 30drops of oil.
Will some d.stramonium clear up bronchoconstriction?

still waiting for my dmso though.

A way to get rid of the eucalyptol must be found.

It looks like what obliguhl has is very high in eucalyptol, while what imPsimon has contains much less, but enough to feel it. SWIM's contains some for sure. It can be smelled, but it's not enough to be active at the doses SWIM has used.

These are the common side effects of eucalyptol:

Stomach pain, vomiting, dizziness, bleeding, difficulty breathing, cough, sleepiness, low blood sugar, skin rash and burning, slurred speech, headache, abnormal heartbeat, low blood pressure, circulation problems, slowing of brain functions and reflexes, seizures, multi-organ failure, coma, death.

 

[obliguhl]

Opened the bottle to test your theory. It does indeed smell like eucalyptos oil, so your theory might be valid. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[69ron]

Opened the bottle to test your theory. It does indeed smell like eucalyptos oil, so your theory might be valid. Thanks for the heads up.

This is a problem. I've been on several different forums, and it seems like quite a few people out there are getting elemi oil that doesn't smell like elemi oil, or at least nothing like the elemi oil I know.

It makes we wonder if people are getting cheated. Maybe some sellers are diluting the elemi oil with eucalyptus oil? I've heard of this kind of thing happening before, but this is usually with expensive oils. Elemi oil is pretty cheap but eucalyptus oil is even cheaper. It's about 1/2 the price.

People who are really into essential oils know about this trick. It's actually pretty common.

Some people say their elemi oil smells like fruit! It should not smell like that! Is there a good cheap place that will analyze stuff for you? Let's say I bought a bottle of elemi oil and it didn't smell like nutmeg and roses, but instead smelled like fruit or lemons as one person on another forum said. That is absolutely not how it should smell. It sounds like elemi oil that's diluted with d-limonene to me, or maybe it's all d-limonene! Unless the buyer knows what elemi oil should smell like, it's easy to be cheated.

I would like, just out of curiosity, to buy a bottle of elemi oil down at the local herb store and have it analyzed professionally, not by a guy I know but an actual professional. Would this cost me a fortune? I'm sure there are places that do this. What would such a place be called? What would I search for on Google to find a place that does this and does it cheaply, if there is such a place. Anyone know?

 

[Bassface]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but flowing visions is now selling a product called Elemi x which claims to be a solution of extracted elemicin. I'll let y'all know what the efficacy is once my order comes in.

 

[Infundibulum]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but flowing visions is now selling a product called Elemi x which claims to be a solution of extracted elemicin.

No shit - this was the most unexpected thing in the world.

 

[Ginkgo]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but flowing visions is now selling a product called Elemi x which claims to be a solution of extracted elemicin. I'll let y'all know what the efficacy is once my order comes in.

I've seen it, and it's grossly overcharged... I think everyone should perform the procedure themselves, it's very easy!

 

[magickpencil]

I've seen it, and it's grossly overcharged... I think everyone should perform the procedure themselves, it's very easy!

Considering the brand-to-brand variation in constituents being discovered and discussed right now, FV has a pretty good deal, I'd say!

 

[q21q21]

Let's say I bought a bottle of elemi oil and it didn't smell like nutmeg and roses, but instead smelled like fruit or lemons as one person on another forum said. That is absolutely not how it should smell.

SWIM's smells like nutmeg and roses

He will give it another try sometime though, would 50/50 DMSO still extract the emelicin?
(SWIM's tripping now, can't quite think straight)

 

[pau]

SWIM upped the ante a couple of evenings back to 2ml Elemi/4ml DMSO. He thinks to get the right result he will have to go to 3 or 4 ml elemi...maybe in a few days. But the effects were there... really nice closed eye moving 3D colorful visuals that invited his consciousness to enjoy them. Dreamy, but sleepy. Did not feel tripping, but maybe felt like he was half way there.

By the way, his elemi oil only in a very distant sense reminds him of eucalyptus....would be surprised if there was much if any eucalpytus in his jar.

 

[69ron]

SWIM upped the ante a couple of evenings back to 2ml Elemi/4ml DMSO. He thinks to get the right result he will have to go to 3 or 4 ml elemi...maybe in a few days. But the effects were there... really nice closed eye moving 3D colorful visuals that invited his consciousness to enjoy them. Dreamy, but sleepy. Did not feel tripping, but maybe felt like he was half way there.

The sleepiness is from eucalyptol.

By the way, his elemi oil only in a very distant sense reminds him of eucalyptus....would be surprised if there was much if any eucalpytus in his jar.

Elemicin way overpowers the smell and taste of eucalyptol. If you can smell eucalyptol in the presence of elemicin, there must be a lot of it present. Keep in mind that the Triple E tech extracts both elemicin and eucalyptol almost equally. This is so unfortunate. The good thing is that elemicin is more potent then eucalyptol, so even in oil that has the same levels of each, like a lot has, the elemicin is the more dominant in effect. But even then, it’s better without eucalyptol. There’s got to be a way to get rid of the eucalyptol. Eucalyptol is not pleasant and blocks a lot of the nice effects elemicin has. SWIM is trying several things and is sure a way will be found to remove it.

 

[pau]

sorry..typing too fast... in above report meant to say, "dreamy, but NOT sleepy". Just pleasantly relaxed and able to enjoy the visuals. Usually, when SWIM is sleepy, he simply goes to sleep! From what one can read about different batches of elemi oil, SWIM is pretty pleased with the bottle he got.

 

[69ron]

Let's say I bought a bottle of elemi oil and it didn't smell like nutmeg and roses, but instead smelled like fruit or lemons as one person on another forum said. That is absolutely not how it should smell.

SWIM's smells like nutmeg and roses

He will give it another try sometime though, would 50/50 DMSO still extract the emelicin?
(SWIM's tripping now, can't quite think straight)

I'm not sure. SWIM is going to do more testing. This issue with eucalyptol needs to be tackled once and for all.

Eucalyptol is also present in nutmeg oil usually in the same amounts found in elemi oil. So once a way is found to easily remove it from elemi oil, it will also likely work with nutmeg oil.

When SWIM took pure elemicin, it was cleaner than SWIM’s personal Triple E extract. It felt more like acid. Was more stimulating. I think this is because of the presence of eucalyptol in SWIM’s oil. Even though he can’t smell it, I think there’s enough for it to mildy effect the trip.

Eucalyptol is a sedative with lots of side effects. As far as I see it, this is garbage and needs to be removed.

 

[69ron]

sorry..typing too fast... in above report meant to say, "dreamy, but NOT sleepy". Just pleasantly relaxed and able to enjoy the visuals. Usually, when SWIM is sleepy, he simply goes to sleep! From what one can read about different batches of elemi oil, SWIM is pretty pleased with the bottle he got.

HA HA HA! I do that all the time with the word “NOT”, leaving it out of a sentence. It’s the worst typo there is. It completely changes the meaning of the whole sentence.