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DMT and Blindness

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gobalswg said:
JamesLove said:
Crick came up with DNA on a LSD trip. Who knows, maybe somebody here will chat with an alien which will drop off a big hint and will cause the next scientific breakthrough.
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What most don't know is that they don't even deserve credit for that as they plagiarized it from one of their female colleagues (I forget the name).
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Yea, after learning that I pretty much stopped reciting the Crick-LSD inspiration in meaningful discussions (although it's still a great card to play if you wanna get under a "straight" person's skin while discussing science/psychedelics) 😉
 
SnozzleBerry said:
gobalswg said:
JamesLove said:
Crick came up with DNA on a LSD trip. Who knows, maybe somebody here will chat with an alien which will drop off a big hint and will cause the next scientific breakthrough.
Click to expand...

What most don't know is that they don't even deserve credit for that as they plagiarized it from one of their female colleagues (I forget the name).
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Yea, after learning that I pretty much stopped reciting the Crick-LSD inspiration in meaningful discussions (although it's still a great card to play if you wanna get under a "straight" person's skin while discussing science/psychedelics) 😉
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If I'm remembering correctly, they didn't plagiarize it from Mrs. Franklin. It was a culmination of all of their work. Franklin was very protective of her studies and she didn't believe in theorizing structures until the structure was actually known. Somehow, Watson and Crick got ahold of her x-rays of DNA and used it to conclude the helical nature of it. Franklin was her own worst enemy; Watson and Crick took advantage of her insecurities, in my opinion. No doubt she would have figured it out sooner or later, but her greed was her downfall.

Where LSD comes into play in all of this, I'm unaware. But instead of pointing to Crick and the structure of DNA, how about you bring up Kary Mullis and his discover of PCR?
Here is a link to him speaking of his use of LSD and his discovery. This is something that cannot be debated. The man won the Nobel Prize for PCR and says (publicly!!) that he doubts he would have figured it out without the help of the psychedelic drug LSD.
 
Ash said:
I know that they wouldn't be able to make sense of an object, but they use touch a lot. So maybe they can understand the shape of something if they see it?
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The shape, texture, size, and other details could be explained to give somewhat of a visual image to the person, but how do you explain colors? Think of trying to explain the difference between a tree and something like the Taj Mahal or the Sistine Chapel. One can be accessed directly, while the other would need quite a bit of information. If the brain has no information whatsoever about imagery, it may be hard to visualize it depending on the amount of detail involved in the image. Especially while balls-deep in a DMT trip 😉
 
I Googled blind person on DMT and found a bunch of pages on the subject and spent about 45 minutes going through them.

The short answer is I could not find a definitive answer on DMT.

Somebody said they saw something on Discovery or whatever about blind people on LSD and they don't see. This did not surprise me.

There were one or two instances of somebody something more definitive on the subject, but nothing was verified and the source didn't seem all that great and was vague.

Some people think that maybe DMT gets released during death though. I had a post in this thread where blind people for life have NDEs and 80% of them can "see". So if DMT indeed has something to do with NDEs, perhaps there is a chance that the experiment would work.

It seems like a very easy experiment to perform. All you need to do is find a person who is blind for life and then convince them to partake.

People have been discussing this for years and the issue could be resolved rather quickly.

Maybe one of you guys can go look in the yellow pages under the blind section and find out.
 
Mindlusion said:
gibran2 said:
A person blind from birth due to damage in the visual cortex will not experience visuals while under the influence of DMT or other psychedelics. Likewise, a deaf person will not hear. If the damage was with the sensory organs, then it’s not so simple. They might see or hear, but not know what seeing or hearing is.

The brain acts as a receiver of signals. If the “hardware” to process those signals is damaged or missing, the signals will not be processed, regardless of their source.

An analogy is an old black-and-white TV. Even if it is being sent color TV signals, it is limited to displaying images in black-and-white. The images it displays reflect the physical constraints of the TV’s hardware/electronics.

Even our everyday perception of the world around us is constrained by our sensory organs and our brain “circuitry”. Similarly, our perceptions of alternate realities while under the influence of DMT are constrained by our “hardware”. This says nothing about the “reality” of the experience.
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I believe this is also why we have optical illusions. Our eyes and our brain do not have the right "hardware" to preceive these illusions normally.
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That just reminded me of something cool>

Schizophrenia sufferers aren’t fooled by an optical illusion known as the “hollow mask” that the rest of us fall for because connections between the sensory and conceptual areas of their brains might be on the fritz.

In the hollow mask illusion, viewers perceive a concave face (like the back side of a hollow mask) as a normal convex face. The illusion exploits our brain’s strategy for making sense of the visual world: uniting what it actually sees — known as bottom-up processing — with what it expects to see based on prior experience — known as top-down processing.



Read More Schizophrenic Brains Not Fooled by Optical Illusion
 
Weird but True story:

Myself and friend were exploring a huge Cave near my home that we had explored many times growing up. One day as were were traveling into this enormous cavern and cave system , we were maybe 5 or 10 minutes deep when we were at a section that is a bit tricky to navigate, two huge slabs of stone , one below and one above both on a 45 degree angle for about 10-15 feet and about 3 feet tall. there is NO bottom when the slab ends, it hangs over a ledge that disappears into darkness, when we would throw stones down, they just kept bouncing, so , one slip and who knows where you would end up, very dangerous and no guide ropes just use your hands and feet.

so anyway we make it across and as we continue on we see a light ahead, it was a lighter actually. There are 3 people already in the cave. sort of grouped together . As we make our way up to them we use our lights and I recognize one of them, he is an old Native American friend I have known since I was young, he was a bit older so I only knew him from seeing him when I was fishing or just around the area , but we were friendly and knew each other by name. He was always out in the woods or by the river. he was most likely a shaman , but at the time, I didn't know or care much for these things.

he was flickering his lighter so we would see them and so we greeted them I asked what they were doing.

He said that he was guiding this man and woman through the cave, they had stopped to smoke ...and that they were on LSD.

Im sure I must have said something like "WOW , thats Cool man , how wild it must be to see all the cave features while tripping , very cool".

He then explained, as the folks sort of just smiled and laughed a bit, that they are also BLIND. they were both Blind and 100's of yards into a Cave while Tripping. WOW.

apparently in the cave , with the echos and the help of the LSD , they could see , or sense the surroundings.

I have to admit we only hung out for a few minutes, I got the sense we were intruding so we left after a few minutes so I did not see what they were doing and I cant know if they were blind from birth or not. at the time I was young, maybe 17 or 18, so it was all very cool and I remember telling many people about it (because how often do you find an Indian and two blind people tripping in a cave?)
- But after reading some of these posts I think I am starting to realize how significant it was for them to experience this space, with a Spiritual guide and the help of LSD , it may have been ( I dont know) the first sense of vision they have known with the aid of the 3rd Eye.


So, maybe not an answer to your question, but a true story that may help get to that answer, at least I have one account where LSD does affect people who are blind in a profound way. I saw it and still find it hard to believe but I swear to you all, It is TRUE.

I will NEVER know how they climbed to that place ~ when two young athletic guys who grew up in those hills had to be very careful to get that deep, It was one to remember.

~Shaman
 
Hopefully someone here can make something of this:
I have a friend who has been blind since birth. He is a long time user of spice - I saw this topic and asked him what it's been like...his response, which he would not elaborate on:

"I can see the world. I see what it truly is. I still feel. I see light and I see dark. The colors of people. Their true colors."

I personally don't really know exactly what that means - but maybe someone with more experience does..
 
Honest to god. Haha, I feel like it would be a bit lame to make that up - with absolutely no beneficial value to myself, or anyone.
I hadn't really thought about how the experience might change until I read this post - and had never thought to ask him.
He seems adamant that he can "see" - though I have the feeling he does not mean literally.
After having a long talk with him last night - he told me that he would explain his experiences after having done a few sessions with me - I'm rather excited.
 
gibran2 said:
A person blind from birth due to damage in the visual cortex will not experience visuals while under the influence of DMT or other psychedelics.
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but how common is it for a blind person from birth to have a damaged visual cortex?
my guess is not common.
more likely damaged photoreceptors, optic radiation, or lateral geniculate nucleus, but if V1 is intact, a blind person can very well hallucinate on a psychedelic.
 
it would be very difficult to tell if what the blind person was experiencing was actually visual because they'd have nothing to compare it to, no point of refenence.
 
camakazi said:
it would be very difficult to tell if what the blind person was experiencing was actually visual because they'd have nothing to compare it to, no point of refenence.
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That's a very good point - I'm interested to hear what he's "seen" though - perhaps it's just his perceptions on things. I really don't know.
 
In a different note - people have told me they've seen things "beyond the imagination" - in such a case, they're things that they've never seen in this reality - therefore, could they perhaps just see different shapes, patterns, entities, etc. If it's something no one else has seen in real life - perhaps it's possible? The imagination is endless.
 
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