Jorkest's D-Limonene Bufotenine Extraction TEK

[Jorkest]

good work dude..SWIM is excited to clean his bufo up again..it sounds pretty sweet though..heating to 350F or so and then dissolve in acetone..and then FASA..then freebase again..pull and filter and evaporate the acetone..

SWIM needs to get some more MEK and acetone and heptane...

 

[WSaged]

good work dude..SWIM is excited to clean his bufo up again..it sounds pretty sweet though..heating to 350F or so and then dissolve in acetone..and then FASA..then freebase again..pull and filter and evaporate the acetone..

SWIM needs to get some more MEK and acetone and heptane...

Yeah, that's pretty much what the process was, after doing your D-Limo/FASA tek in the first place, of course.
Thanks again for that man!!!!
BTW, I only did one D-Limo cleaning before (accidentally) re-toasting.
Then after dissolving the black extract in acetone & filtering, I then did 2 more D-Limo cleanings before drying & doing the FASA on the cleaned extract.

..heating to 350F or so and then dissolve in acetone..and then FASA..

Also, make sure to filter out the black solids after dissolving the re-toasted extract in acetone & before doing the 2nd FASA!!
That shit was waaay black, like fine soot & took forever to pass through the filter the first time!!
That's another thing BTW, filter it a number of times with a fresh cotton filter, before the re-FASA, until there are no more solids collecting in the filter.

I'm excited to extract this new bag of seeds from Maya, now that I've got this tiny pile of clean-ass powder!!
But I need to make myself take a little break!!

I guess I'll just have to finally try some of my hard work instead!!:roll: :lol:


WS

 

[WSaged]

SWIM needs to get some more MEK and acetone and heptane...

I've never worked with MEK, does it clean out some things the D-Limo doesn't?
Think it would be worth it to pick some up & see if it will clean things up even more (like whatever the tan part is...) on the next extraction?

I know 69ron mentioned using MEK for part of his Bufo re-crystallization, with great success before.
I'm not planning to ever boil Zylene ever again!! Took 3 days to air out my place! Yuck!

Jokerst, are you still going with the theory that when cleaning with D-Limonene, almost bringing the D-Limo to a boil, rather than fully boiling it results in a cleaner product?
I have been going with a full boil for 5 min. so far.
If so, I'll try keeping it just below boiling temp on this next one & see how different it comes out.

WS

 

[Jorkest]

yeah...it seems like bringing the d-limo to a full boil for five minutes picks up some other junk...not sure exactly what it is..but the d-limo boils at a much higher temp than xylene does...so it may be doing something not sweet...

 

[Garulfo]

When you cook foods a bit too much, they become darker (almost everything cooked). I guess it has something to do with the carbon atoms.
So it's quite logical that using serious heat (> 100 deg) makes the color darker. Does it means that there is really that more impurities ? Not sure. Maybe using a active charcoal filter could help to get rid about 'burned' carbon molecules ?
But how to know that the substance we want (in that case bufotenine) will not get trapped also by the charcoal ?

 

[Fuego]

trial and error thats how.


thats what were all doing here basically...


the ph 3 boil/ basify/ acetone/ dry leaves you with a pretty nice extraction to start purifying from. its alot cleaner than the casa stuff at first.

im thinking after doing the brasil tek to go and do a casa after that (when i did this with a very small ammount of seeds it gave me the only psychoactive product from any of these extraction atempts ive made, there was also alot less gook than just after the brasil tek).

so after the casa im guessing a further step might be to THEN bake the stuff and find a way to clean it up from there.

something is telling me that these toxins are heavier than bufo, and that when you break them down they become lighter than it and stick around in further steps of extraction. so im gonna just extract as normal and then bake some of the gook, make the leftovers lighter than the bufo and find a way to decant it or something... maybe do another casa after baking! yeah. then an mek/ naptha recrystalization.


so tell me how that naptha mek stuff came out... someone said it was insoluble in naptha... did you bioassay the naptha extracted bufo? im thinking that the stuff in the mek layer would be the bufo and you took out some impurities with the naptha...

 

[Garulfo]

the stuff in the mek layer would be the bufo and you took out some impurities with the naptha...

I'm not sure about what or who you are replying
But I can tell you that MEK and naphta mix together perfectly, so there is NO two layers of Mek/naphta.
SWIM dissolved some gunk in MEK, then added the same naphta amount. During that process, each drop of naphta created a milk cloud in the dark MEK that's why SWIM is thinking that there is something to do here. This led to a small dark layer in the bottom and a main layer quite clear on top. Once evaporated, the main layer (mix of MEK and naphta less many dark stuff) gave undoubtly some active component that was tested sublingually (around 5-10 mg). A bit of nausea and head pressure, then effects were similar to small amount of smoked bufotenine.
SWIM don't know if pure bufotenine would totally left over nausea when used sublingually.

 

[psychonaut]

yeah...it seems like bringing the d-limo to a full boil for five minutes picks up some other junk...not sure exactly what it is..but the d-limo boils at a much higher temp than xylene does...so it may be doing something not sweet...

Try boiling your d-limo on its own, decanting from anything that precips. Then use a thermometer to monitor the temp of the d-limo, not letting it get too hot(140 °C, b.p. of xylene should do). That way you eliminate the possibility of precips. coming from the d-limo, and eliminate the possibility of picking up more toxins the xylene boils didn't(as the xylene boils seemed to work well). This way, you don't lose anything for opting to use d-limo over xylene, and you gain a wonderful orange aroma

 

[69ron]

yeah...it seems like bringing the d-limo to a full boil for five minutes picks up some other junk...not sure exactly what it is..but the d-limo boils at a much higher temp than xylene does...so it may be doing something not sweet...

Try boiling your d-limo on its own, decanting from anything that precips. Then use a thermometer to monitor the temp of the d-limo, not letting it get too hot(140 °C, b.p. of xylene should do). That way you eliminate the possibility of precips. coming from the d-limo, and eliminate the possibility of picking up more toxins the xylene boils didn't(as the xylene boils seemed to work well). This way, you don't lose anything for opting to use d-limo over xylene, and you gain a wonderful orange aroma

That should work very well. SWIM would pre-treat the d-limonene by boiling the hell out of it for maybe 10 minutes and then after it cools down, put it in the freezer overnight, and then decant it. That should completely get rid of any precipitates that might be forming from within the food grade d-limonene.

When using it for bufotenine purification, SWIM would also use a thermometer to monitor the d-limonene temperature. The melting point of bufotenine has been reported to be between 124 -147 depending on the crystal structure formed. So SWIM would take it to 150 C for 5 minutes and then decant immediately, let cool to room temperature overnight, then decant and you should have really clean freebase bufotenine.

 

[Fuego]

the stuff in the mek layer would be the bufo and you took out some impurities with the naptha...

I'm not sure about what or who you are replying
But I can tell you that MEK and naphta mix together perfectly, so there is NO two layers of Mek/naphta.
SWIM dissolved some gunk in MEK, then added the same naphta amount. During that process, each drop of naphta created a milk cloud in the dark MEK that's why SWIM is thinking that there is something to do here. This led to a small dark layer in the bottom and a main layer quite clear on top. Once evaporated, the main layer (mix of MEK and naphta less many dark stuff) gave undoubtly some active component that was tested sublingually (around 5-10 mg). A bit of nausea and head pressure, then effects were similar to small amount of smoked bufotenine.
SWIM don't know if pure bufotenine would totally left over nausea when used sublingually.

oh ok, thanks for clearing that up for me. yeah it was to your post before. that makes alot more sense than what i thought you were saying

so i supose the added naptha changes the solvent proporties enough to precipitate some unwanted gunk eh?

heres an idea for an expiriment then:
take a standard mek/gunk solution and put equal volumes in a few diferent containers. one you just let evaporate, another you add X number of drops, while increasing the ammount until its 50/50 in your last container. find out at about what point stuff stops precipitating. find out if a substancial ammount of bufo stays in solution or at what point it starts droping too.

then design a tek where you add a certain ammount of naptha to precipitate the crap, then after that pour it off and add so much naptha that that the bufo falls out and there you go.

we need standards (for each batch of seeds do a certain tek that is bound to work like 69rons 8x dcm defat thing, so that we can know what % your seeds are to get %yeilds from tek variation to variation), vocabulary, and experiments at every step of extraction to eventually develop a tek thats just fantastic. alot of waste will probably happen, but in the end i think it would be better for the community. when i find the time and money im going to start setting this sort of thing up.

 

[soulfood]

Could anyone tell me what a solution of acetone + bufotenine should look like?

I'm guessing not black.

 

[Garulfo]

Could anyone tell me what a solution of acetone + bufotenine should look like?

Depend if you are speaking about a pure bufotenine solution, which should be quite clear, or a solution made with crude seed extract which can be quite dark.

 

[Garulfo]

so i supose the added naptha changes the solvent proporties enough to precipitate some unwanted gunk eh?

Yes, but I can not say if the precipitate is unwanted gunk or not. With MEK, it seems that the clear layer is the more interresting.

one you just let evaporate, another you add X number of drops, while increasing the ammount until its 50/50 in your last container.

Unfortunatly SWIM have no more basic material to play with. He tried pouring until up to 75/25 naphta/MEK and it was still precipitating.

Some things SWIM learned from his experimentations :

Do not evaporate the food grade limonene, it always leaves with a oily product. It stays oily even when heated at 100+ for a while. Better try to crash out the goodies by pouring slowly some naphta in the limonene (and wait few minutes to see what happens, it is not immediate).
I am speaking about a crude extract obtained from boiled limonene that did not precipitate anything when cooling.

The dark/amber stuff resulting from the limonene+naphta can be 'dried' and is quite solid and shiny.
Acetone dissolve that dark stuff very well, so does MEK (no layer is forming at this state).
But when adding naphta to acetone, there is no milky reaction while there is with MEK+naphta. Not sure it makes any sense, I just give the info in case someone knows what to do with.
SWIM also tried to filter the dark acetone thru active charcoal (before adding naphta), which seemed to not be of any help, maybe the opposite as it may have captured some goodies considering the ridiculous amount of stuff resulting from evaporation.


So here is the next hypothetical tek SWIM will try with a small batch of seeds he may find :

Crush and toast seeds, add carbonate sodium (maybe toast again)
Boil all that in limonene for 10 mn
If something clean precipitate ... good enough.
If not, crash out the gunk with naphta
Three options are possible at this state :

MEK+naphta -> sepate->evaporate
Acetone+naphta -> sepate->evaporate
Ethanol-> slow evaporation (seems a promising possibility to crystalise bufotenine)

SWIM will not bother with A/B or re A/B of the gunk (anyway the gunk showed that is was no soluble in aciditic water)

 

[Fuego]

the naptha crash is pointless unless SOMETHING bad stays in solution...

could you weigh your stuff before and after the crash and then evaporate and tell us if the evaporated stuff is active? (hey if not then we know were crashing the goodies and that this step is good)


another interesting thing:

"after boiling at a low ph and filtering, a dark sticky amber extract was produced (of course). when about 1/3 the volume of sodium carbonate was added it turned a bright yellow/tan and faded to a yellow/brown upon drying. it was beleived to be the base, but when it was added to MEK none of it appeared to dissolve."

i would love to know what happens when that MEK evaporates... if it did take anything with it it should come out extremely pure. If nothing comes out... i should probably tell the guy to add more base and try again?

 

[Garulfo]

the naptha crash is pointless unless SOMETHING bad stays in solution...

That's what I tried to say. When limonene is evaporated after the naphta crash, a oily residue remain. Not a lot, but I bet that this is far to be 100% bufotenine as it never become solid. SWIM did not dare to smoke that oil :x

The solid from the naphta crash was bioassayed and IS active (although it has the belly and head pressure side effects).

i would love to know what happens when that MEK evaporates... if it did take anything with it it should come out extremely pure

I can't say. SWIM did almost the same except that he used an excess of carbonate calcium (more than 100%) and a mix of 60:40 MEK/naphta.
Once evaporated, MEK/naphta leaved a dark amber resine (quite solid tough). Very potent, but far to be "extremly pure".

 

[SpasticSpaz]

So has anyone tried reducing the extract with zinc?

If that works to eliminate or greatly attenuate nausea, it'd be a prettty strong data in favor of 69ron's hypothesis that the nausea is caused by the n-oxide's relative inability to cross the BBB.

 

[Fuego]

wouldnt a CASA also work like the zinc?

and garulfo it looks like the crash IS pointless if BOTH are active... looks like some stays in either one.

heres something interesting swim did:

"i didnt think the base was mixing all too well, and not enough water was added, so when the mixture was in the MEK it did not dissolve. so what i did was add just the slightest bit of water. a few tiny bubbles formed around the goo. when i looked at it thismorning the mek took on a light yellow transparent color."

i think he added just enough water to aid the reaction but not so much that it drastically changed the MEK's solvent proporties and get all the gunk in solution.

 

[Phlux-]

swim had a lil pile of cebil seeds that some other swim had apparently taken - roasted ground and then mixed with bicarb (dont ask me why) - swim was given this a few months ago and was cleaning out the cupboard and decided rather than throwing the 1.2g or so of snuff away he would just run thru this tek with it - not expecting much at all, at the end the dlimonene was boiled and left to sit and over a few hours this appeared in the bottom of the bottle

any chance at all its bufotinene ?

 

[Phlux-]

if so how can swim get it out - it seems solid enough that the d-limonene can be decanted - but then what does swim disolve it in to get it out ?

 

[Garulfo]

Whaow, this look likes really clean. How much limonene was used ? And did SWIY boiled it a long time ?
Why not pouring your limonene thru a coffe filter and keep the solids ?