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Tetrahydroharmine (THH) sublingually

Migrated topic.
No, no, I'm sure SWIM is looking at the same supplier as everyone else. SWIM just also happens to be Someone Who Is Flat Broke at the moment. :)
 
A hydrochloride salt? Hmmm…

The dosage should be different then. Would it be more potent or weaker? Does anyone know?

I assume it should be stronger by weight becuase hydrochloric acid is much lighter than citric acid. But is that always the case? Are some hydrochlorides weaker than citrates?
 
Somehow I doubt that they can confirm or deny anything related to the ingestion of the harmaloids they sell. In fact, it would worry me if they did. A question that could be asked is how many HCl and citric acid molecules per THH molecule. SWIM couldn't devise anything like this from Shulgin's report, since he went from a crude freebase form to the hydrochloride form.

Besides, last time SWIM emailed them, it got bounced back.
 
SWIM's so excited! He's never even tried caapi before. But he's still not sure whether to cap 100mg THH-HCl along with 200mg crude rue extract and take 150-200mg dmt-fumarate or to try insuffulation or sublingual of 20mg THH and smoking spice. He'll probably try the former first and the latter with subsequent orders.
 
A typical dose of ayahuasca contains about 100-200 mg of THH.

You need more if you take it orally. About 200 mg was about as potent as 50 mg sublingually, but the experience lasted about 8 hours as apposed to about 90 minutes or so with the sublingual method.

SWIM is talking about THH citrate, he's never tried THH HCl.

SWIM ordered more THH citrate a few days ago, which they don't seem to carry anymore. SWIM is still waiting for his next batch to arrive in the mail. Should be here Saturday. SWIM will order some THH HCl to compare them.

Again...anyone know a good way to freebase a small amount of material without much loss?
 
having fasted all day (SWIM) consumed 125 mg orally (parachuted)
and smoked the dankest of buds for the first time this week
and thought he experienced slight ego dissolution
but because SWIM is not sure if that's possible
he wants to hear some thoughts?

SWIM wants to know if hes just imagining things


*SWIM and two friends had simultaneous thought*
All three anounced they wanted to smoke more buds
so they did
right now



*****

the next morning
SWIM noticed how emotional he was and concerned about the welfare of others


very interesting to say the least
 
Very interesting.

During the peak of two different THH tests, SWIM had DMT-like visuals for a very short duration. This was not the typical sparkly visual effects SWIM has seen many times throughout the trip. These were DMT like.

The first time it happened from taking 75 mg sublingually. During the peak he shut his eyes and saw complex colorful patterns transforming, morphing, etc., just like with DMT. It lasted about 1 minute and then faded.

The second time, also at 75 mg sublingually, he was typing on his computer and during the peak for 5 minutes the monitor started to sway a little and the colors started changing. This color changing effect spread to the rest of the room. It lasted about 5 minutes and was almost LSD like. This was from THH alone.

These visual effects don’t always happen at 75 mg. And when they do they don’t last long.

Has anyone else had visual effects like that? Or is that just SWIM?
 
for a very short amount of time SWIM also had closed eye visuals
if it can be imagined it was like entering some chamber and walking down a hall of some sort, very short duration,
SWIM hopes he wasnt imagining this too

at its peak 125 mg was causing slight tremors and overall mildly intense
SWIM is looking forward to next time
 
SWIM has recieved 400 mg of THH HCL and is eager to experiment, however, he is unsure of dosage because he is not using the citrate (which previous posters here have been using). Any advice on this..? From my understanding, HCL is lighter (please correct me if I'm wrong!), therefore should be more THH by weight, but to what degree? And is THH in HCL form while inside the vine, like DMT is?
 
try a lower dose...69ron's FOAF tried 200mg and said it was a bit much...he said 100mg might be enough to make spice orally active
 
SWIM is thinking of dissolving 400mg in water and splitting with a fellow explorer - 200 mg THH HCL each, orally, without any other substances. does this sound reasonable? how water soluble is THH?

edit: SWIM is interested in the activity of THH alone rather than as an MAOI or additive :)
 
THH HCl seems to be much more water soluble than THH citrate. But it taste worse.

THH HCl is nearly twice as potent as THH citrate.

I believe THH citrate weighs 408.40194 g/mol and I know that THH HCl weighs 252.73988 g/mol.

So THH HCl should be 1.61589829036873801 times as potent as THH citrate.

So 200 mg of THH HCl would equal about 323 mg of THH HCl.

SWIM has taken up to 300 mg of THH HCl alone. The experience was beautiful and peaceful with very mild visuals during the peak. There were no side effects of any kind and he felt very clear headed.

It peaks after 2 1/2 hours. The whole experience lasts about 8 hours before it’s completely gone.
 
69ron said:
THH HCl seems to be much more water soluble than THH citrate. But it taste worse.

THH HCl is nearly twice as potent as THH citrate.

I believe THH citrate weighs 408.40194 g/mol and I know that THH HCl weighs 252.73988 g/mol.

So THH HCl should be 1.61589829036873801 times as potent as THH citrate.

So 200 mg of THH HCl would equal about 323 mg of THH HCl.

SWIM has taken up to 300 mg of THH HCl alone. The experience was beautiful and peaceful with very mild visuals during the peak. There were no side effects of any kind and he felt very clear headed.

It peaks after 2 1/2 hours. The whole experience lasts about 8 hours before it’s completely gone.

Just to clarify, you meant 200 mg of THH HCL would equal 323 mg THH citrate, and that you've taken up to 300 mg of HCL *citrate* alone (what you posted about in this thread Tetrahydroharmine taken orally - Harmalas - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus )? I got the same weight/dosage advice on a different forum, so that sounds correct to me, thank you :d I will report my experience after I try it this weekend
 
IcerX said:
69ron said:
THH HCl seems to be much more water soluble than THH citrate. But it taste worse.

THH HCl is nearly twice as potent as THH citrate.

I believe THH citrate weighs 408.40194 g/mol and I know that THH HCl weighs 252.73988 g/mol.

So THH HCl should be 1.61589829036873801 times as potent as THH citrate.

So 200 mg of THH HCl would equal about 323 mg of THH HCl.

SWIM has taken up to 300 mg of THH HCl alone. The experience was beautiful and peaceful with very mild visuals during the peak. There were no side effects of any kind and he felt very clear headed.

It peaks after 2 1/2 hours. The whole experience lasts about 8 hours before it’s completely gone.

Just to clarify, you meant 200 mg of THH HCL would equal 323 mg THH citrate, and that you've taken up to 300 mg of HCL *citrate* alone (what you posted about in this thread Tetrahydroharmine taken orally - Harmalas - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus )? I got the same weight/dosage advice on a different forum, so that sounds correct to me, thank you :d I will report my experience after I try it this weekend

Yes 200 mg of THH HCl should equal 323 mg THH citrate.

300 mg of THH HCl should equal 484 mg of THH citrate.

Again that’s based on an assumption that the citrate is a 1 to 1 salt like the HCl is. It might not be though. In that case those numbers would be wrong. But judging by the potency, they seem to be right.

SWIM has taken up to 300 mg of THH HCl alone. He has also taken up to 300 mg of THH citrate alone. The 300 mg of THH HCl was quite a bit stronger, but still very pleasant, no side effects, just more visual, and the mind remained very clear and focused. With either case, the visuals are mild and only seen during the peak. Sort of sparkly, and occasionally you might see a few objects appear, especially in the dark.
 
SWIM and his friend took 200mg of THH HCL each last night. The THH was dissolved in tap water. Effects were very mild for SWIM, and mild to nonexistent for his companion. Moods were elevated, minds were clear, and slight tingling/warmth were experienced in limbs about 30 min into the experience and for the next 2 hours afterward. During those 2 hours, SWIM and his companion ate a small meal. Looking to possibly jump start the sensations, SWIM and his companion smoked a bowl of MJ each roughly 2 hours after initial ingestion. These were the same decent mids that they had been smoking all week, yet this particular session took them to another place. Definite CEV were experienced, with vibrant colors and patterns, and minor OEV were noted as well. They spent the next 3 hours entranced by fractal zooms on the computer screen while listening to various songs. The THH vendor nicely supplied SWIM with a free pair of 'Lazer 3d' glasses, and these were put to use, to amazing effect.

SWIM is experienced with MJ and his companion smokes even more, and the consensus was that the THH had a definite, strong effect on the experience. This morning SWIM felt refreshed without any side effects at all. If SWIM experiments with THH again, it will be with 300 to 400 mg of the THH HCL instead. Would tap water have had a negative effect on the solution?
 
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