Very high dose Harmalas, with or without DMT

[Panpsychic]

I think the taste is a more reliable indicator for tea strength. The more bitter the tea, the higher the alkaloids content, the stronger the effects. This indicator has never been wrong for me when having rue teas. Color might be affected by other things than just the alkaloids content, among them the filtration or seeds origin. I've had strong as well as weak teas with differently looking ones.

I would broadly agree, color is a good indicator though within the same batch and using the same filter process, less so across different batches and with varying seed origin.

Thats why i said intention at the end, if harmalas did you wrong then your intention wasnt right, simple as that.

I think the issue is, Harmalas including the MAOI effects can have adverse effect physiologically. You know yourself there is an adaptation phase. However, I get that you have basically a holy and pure perspective on Rue and how it is interfacing with ones intent and these aspects should not be denied either in the results one gets working with it.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

I think the issue is, Harmalas including the MAOI effects can have adverse effect physiologically. You know yourself there is an adaptation phase. However, I get that you have basically a holy and pure perspective on Rue and how it is interfacing with ones intent and these aspects should not be denied either in the results one gets working with it.

I have taken rue for almost a year straight pretty much every single day from 4g all the way up to 13g, not once did i trust the rue and regretted it, at most if my intention wasnt 100% pure i would have a slightly rough lesson where i would lay down for 1-2 hours, thats it, the only time i was overwhelmed from the rue was the time i wanted to repeat the 30g experience instantly after.

My prespective on rue doesnt change what i said much, you are saying because maois can be risky, well if your taking rue without knowing its a maoi then your intention wasnt right, your telling me someone would know the mystical powers of rue without knowing its an maoi? Obv not.

Sorry if my tone sounded abit aggressive, didnt mean it that way.

 

[The Sofa Traveler]

Thats why i said intention at the end, if harmalas did you wrong then your intention wasnt right, simple as that.

It's not only a question of intention, it's also a question of individual resilience. The fact that regular high doses of rue feel beneficial for you doesn't mean it's something universally shared. Doses that feel safe for you might hurt someone else with a different physical or mind condition, regardless of his 'intention'. Harmalas have a strong and wide pharmacology and not everyone reacts the same way to them. There are numerous cases of intoxication, organs damages and death reported in scientific literature, and most of them come from overdosing and improper use. This must not be underestimated, and those who might wish to follow the same path as you need to be reminded of it. In that sense, I agree with what @Espurrr said.
I understand your enthusiasm toward harmalas, in this forum there are quite a few of us to share it but I just want to remind that this plant should be approached with due respect to his strength and the awareness of its potential toxicity and risks that can follow misuse, all that said within the harm reduction perspective of the forum. One still can enjoy the benefits of regular use of this plant while promoting a lower-risks and balanced approach.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

It's not only a question of intention, it's also a question of individual resilience. The fact that regular high doses of rue feel beneficial for you doesn't mean it's something universally shared.

Im not special, someone who has the right intention would know what to do based on his resilience.

If you have the right intention, you wouldnt dose recklessely without getting to know your resilience first.

most of them come from overdosing and improper use.

Thats what i said, intention.

This must not be underestimated, and those who might wish to follow the same path as you need to be reminded of it.

Ofc, i agree.

 

[northape]

It seems like a clash of perspectives. No need to derail a good thread, though. I do get that "intention" view, but many won't.
Wouldn't it be better to begin from a harm reduction standpoint on an open forum? Some ignorant soul may read it and decide to ingest 30g with mimosa.
This topic is so exciting to me that I kind of forgot about the bigger picture here. Thanks to everyone who kept their calm.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

It seems like a clash of perspectives. No need to derail a good thread, though. I do get that "intention" view, but many won't.
Wouldn't it be better to begin from a harm reduction standpoint on an open forum? Some ignorant soul may read it and decide to ingest 30g with mimosa.
This topic is so exciting to me that I kind of forgot about the bigger picture here. Thanks to everyone who kept their calm.

I dont mind people having different opinions and i said i agree that people choosing this path need to be reminded, i just like to make my points clear, its all good though i like the people here

 

[Panpsychic]

I dont mind people having different opinions and i said i agree that people choosing this path need to be reminded, i just like to make my points clear, its all good though i like the people here

Thats good, and I dont think you will find much disagreement form people on here as long as there is awareness that not everyone who may read an open forum is as conscientious.

That said, I think you have a great deal you can share about some of these high end experiences that few have ventured to.

Did you feel the Rue was calling you to keep increasing to access ever deeper dimensions of it, or were you of the mind you wanted to just keep upping the dose to see what would come since you were tolerating it well?

 

[harmala_afficianado]

Did you feel the Rue was calling you to keep increasing to access ever deeper dimensions of it, or were you of the mind you wanted to just keep upping the dose to see what would come since you were tolerating it well?

Thats a hard question tbh, the rue spirit is really mysterious and it rarely communicates directly, Im not fully sure if the rue was calling me to keep increasing, but i do know it was okay with it, i do think it was calling me to increase at least up to a certain point though.

Its just that ever since i had that 30g trip, i had one objective, which was to try to have that state as my baseline, or at least something close to that state, i kept wondering what will happen when one tries to maintain that state.

Trying to describe that 30g trip wont do it justice, but it was pretty much a state of full on enlightment, imagine being on a heroic dose of mushrooms or dmt, but being in full control of your trip, thats what it felt like, being sent to the deepest depth of this universe but having a very powerful guide making you clear headed and not "lost", even the visuals were under my control, i remember at the time walking in the street going to buy some weed, and just looking around while walking would induce this incredible orgasmic sensation, i just kept repeating in my head "so this is how heaven would feel like", and everytime i would play the music i usually play, i literally couldnt play more than the first few seconds of the song because i felt like i was going to burst into tears, the emotional state i was in was truly out of this world, psychedelics would make me feel like im in higher realms, but this made me feel like i was closer than ever to the highest realm that exists.

I was even with my grandparents at the time, and i remember they were telling me that i was a miracle, and not a normal human, and a "superhero", which sent me even deeper onto the trip, but they seemed to have forgotten about it the day after, there was some real magic that happened that day, i even asked them at the time, you know the plants that i take are a gift from god right? (They knew i was a psychedelic/drug user) and they said we cannot ever disbelieve you.

I have had glimpses of that day with daily use, especially when i went above 10g, i think that "state" is where im at right now, its just that the reward of being in that state is now random and context dependant, not a constant orgasm the whole day.

I do know for a fact though that the rue called me to take those 30gs, because at that time i didnt really like rue, it was just a very random thought that popped in my head, and i did it just out of curiousity.

 

[Jamie01]

How could you have that level of consciousness as your baseline though? Do you have to work? I can not function on what for me is large doses of rue or vine. Anywhere near 10 grams of rue is going to be like Iboga to me, with heavy ataxia and deep astral type dreaming. It’s just not something I want on a Tuesday morning so I’m trying to understand this…are you not tripping like this?

I have also experienced an unpleasant time after my most heavy experience that followed a prolonged period of daily/frequent use of rue and vine. It lasted at least 8 weeks. People should be careful and be aware that harmalas seem to be able to cause longer term shifts in people that might not be wanted. Just ask Dennis Mckenna how that went in Columbia.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

How could you have that level of consciousness as your baseline though? Do you have to work? I can not function on what for me is large doses of rue or vine. Anywhere near 10 grams of rue is going to be like Iboga to me, with heavy ataxia and deep astral type dreaming. It’s just not something I want on a Tuesday morning so I’m trying to understand this…are you not tripping like this?

I have also experienced an unpleasant time after my most heavy experience that followed a prolonged period of daily/frequent use of rue and vine. It lasted at least 8 weeks. People should be careful and be aware that harmalas seem to be able to cause longer term shifts in people that might not be wanted. Just ask Dennis Mckenna how that went in Columbia.

Thats why i said i had no idea how i got there, i was actually walking in the streets in that state, with a perfectly clear mind, no side effects, only pure ecstacy, i only vomited at the end of day after eating a full tablespoon after something like 8-9 teaspoons earlier that day, and after vomiting the euphoria was even stronger and i was just flying in heaven, i actually remember that i was feeling speedy, and that the whole world around me was moving at like 3x speed.

The thing is when i tried to replicate the experience, i was in a semi delirous state, confused and unable to move, i guess my state that day was perfectly alligned with what harmalas want

And i agree harmalas can cause semi permanent shifts, but for me these permenant changes are good for my soul, i realise some people might have negative experiences with harmalas, but from my view i cannot explain how someone could have a negative experience with rue unless his intention wasnt right and/or he didnt know what he was doing.

I think the permanent changes associated with chronic harmala use requires one to have full submission and faith to god, or whatever you wanna call him, i dont think harmalas are for someone who doesnt believe in a creator, its also why harmalas were known historically to be used by arabs and muslims imo.

Seriously though, harmalas powers increase tenfold when your submitting fully to god, and praying all the time etc, there is no doubt in my mind that if i wasnt praying all the time and putting my trust in my creator, i wouldnt have been able to do what i did with rue.

 

[northape]

Either you have some weak seeds or your compatibility with rue is insane. I can't imagine myself walking even on 7g.
Chasing after the dragon is a big no-no, though. I've been there and can attest that it's impossible to replicate these once-in-a-lifetime journeys.
They are put in your life by design, similar to how other people encounter insane circumstances in everyday reality. That's how I see it.
Chasing anything only leads to frustration and being stuck. It's always better to just develop your relationship with a plant and see where it leads.
I'm a bit confused at this point. How strong is your daily dose now?

 

[harmala_afficianado]

Either you have some weak seeds or your compatibility with rue is insane.

They were not weak at all, i had the most powerful trip of my life, i have also used the same exact batch again and i couldnt replicate it.

Chasing after the dragon is a big no-no, though. I've been there and can attest that it's impossible to replicate these once-in-a-lifetime journeys.
They are put in your life by design, similar to how other people encounter insane circumstances in everyday reality. That's how I see it.

For sure, when i tried to replicate it right after it i was taught a rough lesson, i then decided to work with it slowly everyday and see if the rue itself will allow me there, without me interfering.

I'm a bit confused at this point. How strong is your daily dose now?

I was taking 8g daily after going down from 12 a few months ago, but recently smoking cannabis has made it too strong, even if i smoke after the rue effects have faded, so i went down to 6g, but 6g hits as hard as 7-8 when smoking cannabis night before, i would take my rue dose in the morning and smoke at night.

 

[northape]

I see. Thank you for the clarification. Even 6g daily is quite a lot, so my conclusion is that your biology is just that compatible with rue.
There is no other answer that comes to me right now. It's actually fascinating that someone can manage these kinds of doses on a daily basis.

I don't know, maybe open an ayahuasca church or something. You can easily pass as some kind of guru
Seriously though, I don't even know how to properly relate to all this. You're on your own special ride into rue lands for sure.
I guess enjoy it and keep us updated on how it goes for you. Much love.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

There is no other answer that comes to me right now. It's actually fascinating that someone can manage these kinds of doses on a daily basis.

It might seem like it was meant for me, but at the beggining my experience with rue was just like everyone else, it took ALOT of willpower and faith to be able to be where im at right now.

I don't know, maybe open an ayahuasca church or something. You can easily pass as some kind of guru

I really wish i can help other people, it saddens me to see people that are depressed and trapped in loops all the time and not knowing themselves, especially the ones close to me, its like your miserable all the time and you know i am not, why arent you listening? We cant really help people who dont want help at the end of the day.

Seriously though, I don't even know how to properly relate to all this. You're on your own special ride into rue lands for sure.
I guess enjoy it and keep us updated on how it goes for you. Much love.

I have decided to eat the powdered seeds today without capsules, just to see if it will change anything, i havent peaked yet, but i think it did, just the moment my tongue tasted it i knew it was going to be different

It was nice talking to you my friend

 

[Jamie01]

I think the permanent changes associated with chronic harmala use requires one to have full submission and faith to god, or whatever you wanna call him, i dont think harmalas are for someone who doesnt believe in a creator, its also why harmalas were known historically to be used by arabs and muslims imo.

To be fair, name me a bunch of pre industrial groups of people who don’t believe in some sort of creator.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

To be fair, name me a bunch of pre industrial groups of people who don’t believe in some sort of creator.

Not exactly sure what you meant by pre industrial, but either way, belief in god is something only yourself knows, there are countless religious people that say god and this and that but in truth they dont actually believe in him, and the opposite is also true, you never really know who truly believes in god and who doesn't.

 

[northape]

Not exactly sure what you meant by pre industrial, but either way, belief in god is something only yourself knows, there are countless religious people that say god and this and that but in truth they dont actually believe in him, and the opposite is also true, you never really know who truly believes in god and who doesn't.

Pre-industrial societies were involved in some form of theistic religion or paganism (animism). Anyway, they described everything through a higher power. Today, science has taken the same spot, for better or worse. @Jamie01's comment is like a joke because it's so de facto. Yeah, faith is a complicated topic. I try to never go into any kind of dogmatism. Magical thinking is not good long-term either, so it is better to stick to facts. I have burned myself a few times with my stories, so I keep them to a minimum.

 

[harmala_afficianado]

Magical thinking is not good long-term either

For me personally it would be alot more "magical thinking" to not believe in a creator, thats just how i see it, to me even if god himself showed me direct 100% proof hes there, it wouldnt change anything, i KNOW he exists, not "believe", i have seen everything i needed to see in this life to know hes there, its clear as day if you actually look.

Also, imo, belief and faith are the same thing, because how can you believe in an all powerful creator but cant believe that he can help you in life? It just means you dont really believe.

But when you fly to higher dimensions there also other entities, some of them are disgusting and filthy, and they hate you with all of what they have, i think they are responsible for terms like "magical thinking" and "psychosis" because most people who somehow move past dimensions in any way they mostly come in contact with these "filthy" entites because thats the frequency they are currently vibrating in, so people are just afraid of this topic in general because they have seen the harms associated with it.

Thats my opinion

 

[Jamie01]

Not exactly sure what you meant by pre industrial, but either way, belief in god is something only yourself knows, there are countless religious people that say god and this and that but in truth they dont actually believe in him, and the opposite is also true, you never really know who truly believes in god and who doesn't.

Western culture is very individualistic. It’s a selfish culture that puts a lot of emphasis on being an individual…carrying your own weight etc. Indigenous pre industrial cultures don’t/didn’t always experience their social structures in this way. It can be more of a group dynamic maybe with less room for this sort of individual thought process. It’s all me me me. My god..me knowing..

 

[northape]

Also, imo, belief and faith are the same thing

Belief is when you trust some idea you have, while with faith you put your trust into an unknown beyond yourself.
By "magical thinking," I mean projecting your desires onto God. God is like the sky, not a guy in the sky
It's a grand intelligence yes, but without a personal volition. At least that's how I see it.